34th Annual Congress of the Russian Union of Industrialists and Entrepreneurs

Putin attends Plenary Session

Along with President of the Russian Union of Industrialists and Entrepreneurs Alexander Shokhin, President Putin again took part in the Plenary Session of the Union’s Congress. Here’s what the Kremlin provided as its preamble to the transcript:

The agenda includes key areas of interaction between business and the state, as well as initiatives of the business community aimed at achieving national development goals and implementing national projects.

The congress is attended by about 1300 people, including the largest entrepreneurs, representatives of small and medium-sized businesses from all over the country, heads of ministries and departments, and state political figures who are key for Russia’s economy.

At the end of the congress, the President held a separate meeting with members of the RSPP Bureau.

The Congress has a public and closed session, the latter happening when the cameras are turned off reflecting the fact that Russia still feels parts of its economic development to be strategic and thus secret. The 43-minutes begins with a monologue by host Alexander Shokhin, then moves to Putin’s remarks followed by a short discussion between the two prior to ending the open session. Let’s find out what this year’s Congress is focused upon:

: Dear Vladimir Vladimirovich,

Thank you for taking the time to communicate with the delegates and guests of the 34th Annual Congress of the Russian Union of Industrialists and Entrepreneurs in a difficult schedule.

We know that today you have a very important telephone conversation, on which a lot depends, not only in the development of Russian-American relations, but also in the settlement of the situation in Ukraine and the resolution of many other geopolitical issues.

We discussed quite a wide range of issues before you arrived. First of all, these are questions related to how to pass, so to speak, the golden mean between a controlled contraction of the Russian economy in order to suppress inflation and prevent overcooling of the Russian economy. In this regard, many colleagues spoke about the criteria for choosing investment projects that cannot be abandoned.

These include projects that are at a high stage of implementation, projects aimed at national projects, including national projects of technological leadership, and projects where the maximum multiplier is available and for every ruble of investment, you can get 5.7 rubles of return.

We would like to see these additional criteria used in our dialogue with the Government, which will be formulated on the spot, so that projects don't have to be selected specifically. Although thanks to our meetings, among other things, we have established platforms, some platforms have been resumed, in particular, the sub-commission of the Government Commission on the Sustainability of the Russian Economy has resumed its work since December, and the situation in various industries with the participation of business is discussed there several times a month. We have also formed a working group with the Central Bank, where we discuss the situation in industries and individual borrowers, in order to prevent chains of non-payments, pre-bankruptcy status, and so on. In other words, the work is underway, although we understand that much depends not only on targeted solutions, but also on systemic measures.

The second major issue is the personnel shortage. Many colleagues—both Government members and business representatives—spoke today. We see here, on the one hand, the possibility of such an extensive expansion of the working time fund through the removal of a number of restrictions on part-time work at the main workplace and by streamlining migration flows. In particular, it would probably be right now to focus on the additional shift method of recruiting migrants from visa-free countries through the organized recruitment mechanism. As we know, the Government is preparing a corresponding draft law. We are ready to bring the experience of companies here.

But, of course, the main thing is still the growth of labor productivity, including such well-known methods as lean production, and such areas as automation and robotization of production. Here, of course, you can also not do without investment. And here, too, we need to find an opportunity not to let this topic out of our sight even with limited budget opportunities, especially since we also have additional requirements for technological leadership here.

An important topic that we discussed in the context of personnel policy is the professional education system. Both secondary professional education and higher professional education. Hundreds, if not thousands, of Russian industrial partners have been included in such projects as "Professionalitet" and "Advanced Engineering Schools".

We believe that these projects should be expanded. Here, the Government supports this topic. But equally, they need to be expanded not just to include new colleges or universities, but, in particular, to focus the same "Professionals" on retraining the adult population as well. This is especially important for retraining, retaining and upgrading the skills of veterans of the SVO who are returning and who need some kind of career perspective, taking into account the fact that they are already, so to speak, people who rightfully claim more than what they had when they left for the SVO.

Among the topics that we discussed, there are also questions that we raised at the last congress, and during meetings with you in December last year, in particular, and at the congress last year, and in a public format, and in the format of a meeting with members of the RSPP bureau. I would like to remind you of some of the topics that we still have in our work.

In particular, we are talking, for example, about expanding social partnership. The Constitution introduces the concept of social partnership as one of the main principles. A year ago, and you supported this topic, we raised the issue of mandatory membership of leading companies and socially and economically significant organizations in one of the employers ' associations, be it regional, industry, inter-industry, all-Russian, and so on. And also about building such a interconnected system of employers ' associations.

A year has passed since that congress. To be honest, we have not made much progress so far, although we have prepared the relevant draft laws. And it turns out that the largest companies say that this is a big burden for them, including paying contributions to organizations. To be honest, you can probably help them, of course, in some way.

The second topic is the regulatory impact assessment procedure, which does not apply to tax and fiscal bills. When the ODS mechanism was introduced 15 years ago, from the very beginning we raised the issue of fiscal changes passing through ODS. But the Ministry of Finance has always believed that businesses are against any tax change if it is not in favor of the business.

But, on the other hand, a year ago we found a balance of interests, found compromises. And the changes in the tax system that came into effect on January 1 of this year show that business is not only calm, but also sympathetic to these changes and, moreover, is ready to refine some things so that they work more efficiently.

Therefore, we believe that it would be right to move in this way. Even those public platforms that the same Duma is ready to provide: expert platforms or parliamentary hearings. We often have documents that are marked "For official use" in the process of being prepared, and we don't have time to discuss them just by the time they are accepted. There is a commission on legislative activity, although many of my colleagues at the deputy level are represented in this commission. I enter myself so that I don't miss a single opportunity to formulate a business position.

An important issue–-excuse me, Mr President, I'm already tired of this topic—is the protection of the interests of bona fide property purchasers, including in the process of privatization transactions.

You said that purchasers should not be held responsible for mistakes made by federal or regional authorities. To be honest, we have worked through many aspects of this process of reviewing the results of privatization and we believe that it is quite possible to develop procedural rules that will make this process more orderly. In particular, we are talking about using the statute of limitations and the pre-trial period based on the norms of the Civil Code. In other words, we believe that privatization transactions are business transactions, and the Civil Code should apply here. In addition, it is impossible to refer to the fact that mistakes in privatization violate the intangible rights of citizens, for which, as is known, there is no statute of limitations and can not be.

I think that we can probably finalize this topic in some way, especially since we see that the Presidential Council for the Codification of Civil Legislation is also actively involved in this work.

I am sure that the results of today's congress and the discussion that will continue in the open part will help us to promote certain issues.

And one more request, Mr President, since there have been a lot of speeches today from both business and government representatives: if we formalize these proposals, including those based on the 19 forums of the Russian Business Week that took place in February, and ask you to instruct the Government to work on them together with us, it would be a great deal we will help you to register that all issues have been resolved in a year. We would very much like that.

Thank you.

Vladimir Putin: Dear Alexander Nikolaevich, Dear friends and colleagues,

Alexander Nikolaevich drew attention to my schedule. Indeed, the powers of the President under the Russian Constitution are large. But I would like to say that even without any constitutional powers, the significance of your work is of permanent importance, because you are responsible for thousands of collectives, you are responsible for the social and material well-being of millions of people.

Indeed, there are always a lot of questions. Alexander Nikolaevich has just spoken about protecting the interests of bona fide purchasers and everything related to privatization. We have already discussed this a hundred times, and rightly so: we must discuss it until we finally decide. But at the same time, Alexander Nikolaevich mentioned that not all large entrepreneurs and large companies want to join the Russian Union of Industrialists and Entrepreneurs and said: maybe we should help them? You see, even within the community, such epistemological contradictions sometimes arise, as people who are engaged in science say. But we will still do all this, discuss it and, I hope, solve it.

I am very happy to welcome all participants of the plenary session of the organization, which unites leading domestic companies. And these are, of course, real market leaders, including those on a global scale.

At the beginning, I would like to thank the members of the Russian Union of Industrialists and Entrepreneurs for their involvement in the public agenda of development, for their active participation in the preparation of measures that strengthen our economy and our sovereignty, make the investment and business climate in the country more comfortable and meet the needs of business, which helps Russian enterprises and their labor collectives to clearly understand the long-term prospects of work, form development plans, important both for specific companies and for entire industries.

I hope that I will be able to answer some of the questions that Alexander Nikolaevich outlined. If not, we will still have a meeting with the RSPP bureau. We will have the opportunity to talk, as they say, behind closed doors, absolutely frankly, on some issues.

There are indeed a lot of issues here, including improving the regulatory framework for the real sector, removing excessive barriers, and generally improving the regulatory environment for businesses. In short, we are talking about a complex, multi-faceted cooperation, which, unfortunately, does not go without hitches. Unfortunately, some papers are delayed somewhere, approvals take a long time (this was also mentioned just now), or difficulties and uncertainties arise that could not have been foreseen, and they slow down the overall work.

It is absolutely correct that you directly designate these problem areas. I am sure that our colleagues from the Government will work with you to quickly resolve these issues and cooperate with you in the interests of the state and the business community. I would like to note that Russian business has faced serious challenges in recent years. You and I know that very well. These include strong sanctions pressure, especially restrictions on international settlements and operations on foreign markets. These and other actions generally undermine the freedom of trade and investment in the global economy, which I will also say a few words about separately.

It is important that during this time, domestic entrepreneurs have learned how to work in the face of sanctions, adapted to them, thought out and launched alternative mechanisms for cooperation with foreign partners, with those who want to work with us. In addition, sanctions have become a kind of additional catalyst for positive structural changes in our economy, including in the financial, technological spheres, and in many other key areas.

I know that business experts are now actively discussing what will happen next with illegitimate sanctions against Russia, our companies, and our citizens: they will be lifted, retained, strengthened, and so on. Dear friends and colleagues, I suggest that we proceed from the following considerations.

As a matter of fact, they are on the surface.

Sanctions are not temporary or targeted measures, they are a mechanism of systemic, strategic pressure on our country. And no matter how the situation develops, no matter what the system of international relations is, our competitors will always have the desire to restrain our country, weaken its economic and technological capabilities.

And if earlier the Western so-called elites tried to give this opposition at least some semblance of decency, now it seems that they do not need to be shy, they are not going to be shy. They not only regularly threaten Russia with new sanctions, but also stamp out these packages one by one. It seems that the initiators themselves have lost track of how many restrictions they have imposed and against whom.

So the Ministry of Finance calculated it. I can tell you with confidence, with confidence. 28,595 sanctions against individuals and legal entities. This is more than all the sanctions against all the countries against which sanctions were imposed, and many times higher.

Even if there is some gesture from the other side--they say that something is supposed to be removed, weakened--we can expect that there will be another way to push, put some sticks in the wheels, as was the case with the well–known Jackson-Vanik amendment. Even the Soviet Union, against which it was introduced at the time, was no longer there, and relations between Russia and the United States of America were at their best. And the amendment continued to work. And when it was supposedly canceled, it was actually simply replaced with another restrictive act against Russia. Remember that. They canceled and immediately imposed other sanctions.

I repeat: sanctions and restrictions are the reality of the current new stage of development, which the whole world, the entire world economy, has entered. Global competition has escalated and is becoming increasingly sophisticated and irreconcilable.

Thus, a new spiral of economic competition is unfolding right before our eyes, and in these conditions it is even embarrassing to recall the norms and rules of the World Trade Organization, which were once actively promoted by the West. Once. When? When these rules were beneficial to them. As soon as they became unprofitable, everything immediately began to change. And all these negotiations are stalling. And nobody really needs them.

Obviously, and I've already said it more than once: as it was before, it will no longer be. There is no hope for complete freedom of trade, payments and capital flows, just as there is no need to rely on Western mechanisms to protect the rights of investors and entrepreneurs. Yes, Alexander Nikolaevich just said, and I actually started with this: we have our own systemic problems related to privatization, with the protection of the rights of bona fide purchasers. You know my position. Something is stalling here, but we will work together to resolve this issue completely.

What do I want to say? We have, but there are enough of these problems. Admittedly, these mechanisms have worked with a creak before. I am referring to those proposed by our so-called Western partners. And now the cover is completely gone, as they say: it has become obvious to everyone what the various "high courts" in European capitals and Western jurisdictions are worth, in which many sought to hide themselves there and dig something up quietly. All. None of this is happening. And there are no hidden jurisdictions.

In these circumstances, it is important for Russian businesses to show flexibility, search for and explore new markets, develop their own technological solutions and establish cooperation with reliable partners, and there are also enough of them in the world. But here, of course, the Government and our regions must provide the necessary support. For my part, I will do everything possible to support this process.

Russia is strengthening its own sovereignty, and in all areas that support the work of business, including the development of transport, logistics, financial and payment infrastructure. We are doing this right now and will definitely continue.

I know and understand what difficulties you are facing, but we will do everything possible to help you. I would like to emphasize that only those countries that can ensure real, full-fledged sovereignty become resistant in general and to external pressure in particular, and are capable of dynamic, progressive development in the interests of their peoples.

I'll give you a good example. As a matter of fact, it is already well-known, but I will take advantage of the situation and say it again. We see how most European countries have lost their sovereignty, and as a result, they have faced serious problems both in the economy and in the security sphere. As for the economy, all of them have near-zero growth rates or are even entering a recession. On the contrary, the BRICS countries and those countries that want to participate in our association understand the benefits of adding up their potentials, have been leading global growth in recent years, and have set a high bar for economic dynamics.

Let me just remind you that in 2024, the GDP growth of the eurozone was 0.9 percent, the "big seven"—why it is big, it is not clear what is big there; wherever you look, you can't see anyone on the map—so this "seven" has 1.9 percent growth, and the BRICS–-4.9. In Russia, two years in a row, both last year and the year before, 4,1. (Applause.) I know, I'll tell you more about it now, of course. By the way, you applauded yourself, these are your results, thank you. I'll give you a round of applause. (Applause.)

By the way, Alexander Nikolaevich was just talking about the cooling of the economy. Here, of course, you need to act very, very carefully. It is clear that this is inevitable, and both the Government and the Central Bank have spoken about it. In general, as if agreed. It is necessary that in practice everything should be as planned, so that there is no such excessive cooling as in the cryocamber, but slowly so that everything is there. I won't do it now, the numbers are known. The Central Bank has the same figures, while the Government and the Ministry of Economic Development have different ones. This is not 4.1 percent, but 2-2.5 percent. But you need to make sure that there is no collapse, no extra frost. It's a subtle thing, but I hope it works.

We can still talk about it. But I suggest that we don't start a discussion right now, because we'll be talking until morning, I know that.

Were we with Maxim Stanislavovich Oreshkin yesterday or today already… What time did we break up, two o'clock, right? At three in the morning. So we really talked until morning. I hope that we will still follow the path that we will follow carefully and achieve the result we need.

But the eluding of so-called Western dominance and the emergence of new global growth centers is a long-term trend. That's what I want to emphasize. Yes, of course, we understand all the advantages of our so-called Western partners: high technologies, organization of production–-everything is there, it's true, they have achieved a lot. We need to treat this with respect and take all the best, but do not copy it.

And we must understand that growth rates in various regions of the world will be stable over the coming decades. And the fact that due to a number of circumstances, we have had a certain reorientation (by the way, through no fault of our own)–-maybe this is a good thing. We are reorienting ourselves to global promising markets. And what we need, we will still get.

Of course, this long-term trend will continue. It will be supported, among other things, by the BRICS development platform, which is currently being formed. It will cover the resource, technological, human resources, financial, trade and investment components, and at a fundamentally new level, with the involvement of modern digital solutions, which makes the platform as efficient as possible and free from negative external interference.

I very much hope that Russian business will take an active part in these joint projects with our BRICS partners and its future members.

Dear colleagues, I will touch upon another important issue that concerns domestic business and concerns Russia's relations with foreign countries. I would like to say this again: we are talking about the return of foreign companies, the possible return of foreign companies that left our market in 2022, and even later.

I have already said that Russian business has taken advantage of this opportunity wisely, occupied the vacant market niches, invested, created jobs and devoted a lot of time and effort to the development of technologies.

Yes, now some of these companies that have left are going to return, we know about this, but I will not go into detail now, so as not to interfere with anything. But our companies that have taken their place are at different stages of the investment cycle. Someone has already made investments, set up production, and someone is only at the beginning of projects and is developing construction, despite the high key rate. And of course, we have no right to undermine these plans, to reduce to zero the invested forces and funds.

The interests of Russian companies, enterprises, and their employees will always be a priority for us. It is from these positions that we will consider the issue of returning foreign businesses to our market.

I would like to note that among the foreign companies that left Russia under the political pressure of the so-called elites of their countries, there are those who retained their personnel, technologies, and handed over management to the Russian management. In fact, they continued to work in our market, but under a different brand. We understand that such investors risked a lot and could have faced a negative reaction from their governments, but they made an independent and responsible choice, and, of course, we respect this choice and will treat such partners with respect.

But there were other companies that defiantly slammed the door, wanted to sell their Russian segment, by the way, often at a large discount, and so they did. Or, even worse, they began to sabotage their activities and thereby put entire teams, their Russian clients, suppliers, and contractors in a vulnerable position. By the way, these companies are well known to us, and we were forced to introduce temporary management in them.

I understand that some Western owners were frightened and did not find the strength to contradict their political authorities. This explains their behavior. But in case the wind changed, they still left a loophole for themselves: they retained the right to buy the business back, provided for an option.

I ask the Government to closely monitor this situation and similar transactions, so that it does not turn out that the owners sold the business in Russia at a bargain price, in fact, left it to its fate, and now they want to buy the asset back, but for the same modest money. It doesn't have to be like this, it doesn't happen like this.

The market situation is already different: companies have grown stronger, increased their capitalization, and are operating in a different way. Therefore, it is obvious that each such transaction will require a separate, thorough review.

I would like to repeat once again: we did not expel anyone. Those who left our market made such a decision themselves; under the pressure of the elites of their countries, without pressure—it doesn't matter anymore. In any case, we are talking about experienced businessmen who calculated the risks and understood the consequences of their actions. If the niches of Western companies are already occupied by Russian business, then, as I said earlier, we have people saying it, the train has left, there will be no privileges and preferences for those returning.

At the same time, Russia remains an open country. Anyone who wants to return, please let them return on a competitive basis within our legal framework. I ask the Government to update the list of foreign companies that have stopped working in Russia, as well as to develop a procedure for coordinating their return with mandatory guarantees of fair and responsible business conduct in our country. But this process, of course, should be as transparent as possible.

Dear colleagues! Russia implements large-scale and long-term development plans, launches major infrastructure, industrial and transport projects, develops vast unique territories of the Far East, Siberia, the Arctic and other regions of our country, and strengthens promising and mutually beneficial ties with the vast majority of countries in the world.

Now the main challenge for the domestic economy is the transition to a stable trajectory of balanced growth. I want to emphasize this: on the trajectory of balanced growth. We will have to ensure high-quality, intensive dynamics in the real sector by modernizing production facilities and increasing labor productivity (and it is better, of course, if this is done not in an intensive way, but through the introduction of new technologies), increase the output of goods and services across the widest range, formulating the supply economy.

At the same time, it is important to avoid unbalancing individual industries and distorting key macro parameters–-our most important task. In particular, it is necessary to contain inflation and ensure low unemployment. This is a common joint task of both the authorities and businesses–-not only large, which unites the Russian Union of Industrialists and Entrepreneurs, but also small and medium-sized businesses.

It is based on the requests of entrepreneurs that we will continue to build the mechanisms of the entire state economic policy, including monetary policy, so that these mechanisms primarily work to increase Russia's production potential, open new enterprises, strengthen the country's technological and financial sovereignty, and strengthen its human resources.

The Government is currently preparing a corresponding plan of additional measures. I look forward to active participation in this work of the Russian Union of Industrialists and Entrepreneurs, as well as other business associations of our country. And of course, I wish you all success for the good of Russia.

Thank you.

Alexander Shokhin: Mr President, thank you very much for your informative report on key issues that concern both business and government.

And indeed, you concluded by saying: for the good of Russia. As you can see, our slogan is "RSPP: Uniting business for the benefit of Russia".

Vladimir Putin: I read it.

Alexander Shokhin: Thank you. So we didn't try in vain.

Vladimir Vladimirovich, I would like to inform you that two years ago, from this rostrum, you instructed the Russian Union of Industrialists and Entrepreneurs, together with interested authorities, other business associations, and social partners, to establish the Responsible Business Leaders Award and instructed the winners and laureates of the award to present appropriate awards at the annual RSPP congresses.

Just for the record, I would like to say that we held this ceremony today. Among the award winners are PhosAgro, Metalloinvest, Severstal, and Norilsk Nickel. Russian Railways, Gazprom, SIBUR, RUSAL and, perhaps, the lesser-known Pigment company became the winners of the award. There are still a number of winners in certain areas of socially responsible behavior of companies. But in general, two years of awarding this award show that it was a good project that allowed us to mobilize not only large companies that conduct non-financial reporting, and this was also a condition of the award, which you mentioned two years ago, but also medium-sized companies are catching up. We will now summarize the experience of two years of holding the award and, perhaps, adjust some provisions to expand the scale, so to speak, of companies ' participation and report back to you the results of our work. Next year, there may be more well-known companies among the winners.

At this point, I would like to thank you, Mr Putin, given that, judging by Dmitry Peskov's statements, you should have a conversation with Donald Trump before 18 o'clock.

Vladimir Putin: I didn't hear it, it's his job.

Alexander Shokhin: I don't know, but now we need to see what Trump will say to this phrase, he likes to give interviews, and maybe he will react already.

Vladimir Putin: I didn't mention Trump, I was talking about Peskov.

Alexander Shokhin: He knows that we are having a discussion.

But in fact, since you have a very tough agenda for today and the next few days, I would like to thank you and conclude this public part of our conversation and, judging by what you have said, continue the discussion with the members of the RSPP bureau and the large companies that have joined us, which are still working on this issue. not members of the Russian Union of Industrialists and Entrepreneurs. Perhaps, after all, the "entrance ticket" can be made through membership in the Russian Union of Industrialists and Entrepreneurs?

Vladimir Putin: Do members of the Russian Union of Industrialists and Entrepreneurs have any advantages?

Alexander Shokhin: Look, we are organizing a congress. It has long been a tradition that after the public part of the congress–-a meeting with the Bureau of the Russian Union of Industrialists and Entrepreneurs. We have only 30 members of the bureau. Do you know how many people are participating today? Almost 90 people.

Vladimir Putin: So you don't have to leave? (Laughter in the audience.)

A. Shokhin: These are those who have joined. (Laughter.) Therefore, there are virtually no privileges, except for a sense of responsibility to their employees, to the Constitution, where social partnership is prescribed.

In fact, we are talking about the fact that, despite, so to speak, formal circumstances, really responsible companies have gathered here, who see not only their own future in the form of financial performance growth and so on, but also think about the future of the country. What you said today about Russian business, which successfully occupies the vacant niches and deals with issues of technological sovereignty and leadership, and implements social programs.

By the way, two years ago, one of the key topics was redomicilation, that is, the relocation of Russian companies from abroad, from offshore zones to Russian jurisdiction, and the desire for ownership. This process is almost complete, by the way, largely due to our discussions and the effective work of our colleagues: the Ministry of Finance, the Ministry of Economic Development, and the State Duma. In this sense, there is no place to invest except in Russia. Thank you also, as you said, to those who impose sanctions.

Vladimir Putin: No, you can invest. The world is huge, the world is colossal, so you need to invest where it is profitable for you, and it is profitable for Russia, the profit is high, and investments are reliably protected. There are many such regions of the world.

Here are colleagues who are investing in Africa and Asia. Where they invest, they need for production here, someone invests, some production is transferred, because it is easier to work on world markets from there.

I know a lot, we meet regularly. Therefore, there is much to invest in. There are countries that, as you know, have already accumulated so much money in all sorts of funds, they do not know where to put it. As the main character of "Viburnum red" said, " money burns your thigh." Remember, right? That's the problem for them, the funds are huge, colossal, and have already grown to the skies. Well, why are they lying somewhere out there, in such, sorry for the bad language, already dumb jurisdictions. What to do with them, what will happen to them? Everyone is thinking about it, everyone is thinking about it. You know that very well. Everyone was wondering what will happen to these funds that are stored in Western banks? Everyone thought about it. Well, of course, this is a signal for the entire global economy. We need to look for these investment opportunities. There are many of them. Of course, the state's task here is largely to ensure the interests of Russian business. It's true. But this safe haven should be the economy of our country itself, of Russia itself. Of course, we still have a lot to do.

I know they don't talk about it now, but we'll probably meet with our colleagues in a narrow format… Although 90 companies are also not so narrow. We also need to work with the law enforcement sector. If you have noticed, I always speak at all the collegiums (tomorrow, in my opinion, the prosecutor's office, I will speak there): we need to protect the interests of Russian business, we need to do everything possible to ensure that the legal system promotes business to go here, is not afraid of anything, and that the judicial system is independent and efficient. We still have a lot to do. I understand, I understand everything. Believe me, we will do everything for this.

What's so good about it? They freeze everything in general, you know, they take everything away rudely, not in a civilized way at all. I'm not even talking about any legal systems–-they just don't exist. They exist there only for themselves. That's the trick. Do you understand?

By the way, I noticed this in the political sphere a long time ago, a long time ago. I won't mention your last name right now. Here they are discussing some political issue: we are doing so, so, so. Sorry, you think: damn! I sometimes said: "It is also impossible, it contradicts..." – " Well, nothing, it contradicts-so it is expedient." That's all. And there it has long been used in the field of politics. Now everything in the economic sphere has already started to grow at full speed.

Therefore, it is impossible to trust, but it is necessary to create such a political system, legal and law enforcement practice within the country. We need to work together on this to make it tough, stable, and reliable. I think this is a good example of how this work has developed in recent years between the business community and the Government.

Join the Russian Union of Industrialists and Entrepreneurs! (Laughter in the audience.)

Alexey Shokhin: Friends, on this optimistic note, I suggest that we end the public part.

Thank you, Vladimir Vladimirovich, for your participation and for your kind words.

Vladimir Putin: Thank you for the invitation. [My Emphasis]

Putin’s talk at the end about the nature of the West being unlawful and thus bad for business because all business is based on law was very important. and yes, Putin does met with all the law-enforcement related bureaus at their collegiums, including that of the judges and supreme constitutional court, all of which I usually report on. Putin’s opinion that the sanctions will never be completely lifted has the backing of history. Perhaps by 2080 or so the West will see the need to be honest again. Perhaps that will occur sooner, but Rusia cannot wait for that to happen and must chart its own course. Yes, trying to balance the economy is difficult to do. I note there was no mention of wages keeping or out pacing the rate of inflation, but most general economic measures went undiscussed. Clearly, the need to get the closed discussion finished so Putin could have his important talk with Trump was appreciated, so the session was shorter han normal. That the Russian Union of Industrialists and Entrepreneurs backs the educational plan related to personnel advancement was an excellent signal to the harmony existing between all the actors impacting Russia’s future development. I’d like to get 5.7 dollars back for every dollar I invest, but such possibilities don’t exist here or elsewhere in the West.

Now to find out what we’re allowed to know about the Trump-Putin chat.

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