I hadn’t at all planned to write anything about Timur Ivanov or his criminality, but that all changed when I visited Marat Khairullin’s Telegram to read his update where he had written a long expose about Ivanov instead. Since much of the Oligarch 1990s and first portion of Putin’s years were so deeply mired in corruption and little is written about it in the West, I’ve always wanted to know more about this aspect of Russia’s past. Marat is clearly a student of those times and has a great deal of contextual background into those events as well as those of a more recent vintage. IMO, readers will be just as fascinated with Marat’s writing as I was. You’ll discover the very Russian way of dealing with this issue that differs greatly from the Chinese method while retaining just a bit of Stalin’s method. It also provides insight into the methods of the West when it comes to exerting influence and undermining governments from within. Yes, the read is long, but when you finish most will want to read more.
Very interesting. Corruption of course can't really exist without government, and therefore the bigger the government the bigger the potential corruption. So many like to assume that Russia is the lead in the resistance, a Christian state of morality and honesty. The West of course constantly refers to their endemic corruption. The Russians are obviously well aware of their corruption issue but have their own way of dealing with it, seems don't cross the line to disloyalty or get overly greedy and you are allowed to continue, if not then arrested. This of course could be interpreted that stealing a bit is OK but not so as to damage the state, as such how high does it go?
We in the West of course liked to pretend that corruption was negligible, whereas the truth of course is that it also is endemic. I found interesting the Russian observation that if all the corrupt were arrested then there would be no one left to run the state, Russia at least is trying to chip away at it, we though are still drowning in it with no end currently in sight. Needless to say the financiers that run the world set the example to all below to steal all you can get your hands on, just as they do.
Did you note the specific nature given of the two forms of theft? As here inside the Outlaw US Empire, the theft is from all the people except for those doing the thieving--very little is theft from the government--whereas theft from the people is considered very evil in Russia. Stealing from the state isn't as bad but depends on the category of what's being stolen.
It's a very good point. Endangering the lives of your soldiers, delivery of social services like Health, Education, pensions. When you've undermined this trust it's a slippery slope. It's funny in my experience having an annual anti-corruption test to pass, not one doughnut, but for politicians, not so much awareness.
A lot of people on these sites/blogs seem to believe that Russia can do no wrong and all the sins of the world reside in the West and/or Israel. So it is good to read of the endemic corruption with the Russian MIC, though I am still perplexed as to why in this case it was treated as "treason" rather than "business as usual". Well, he has been very publically arrested so no doubt we will find out. Perhaps the truth (or at least what we are told) will upset some of the readership here - at least in the sense that it won't fit with their view of Russia and its internal affairs?
When Prig went off the rails and launched his infamous 24 hour rebellion there was much debate in the blogosphere about whether this was a tantrum, 5D chess, a CIA backed coup or something else. I said at the time it was a western backed coup - given the timing and Prig's very public statements repeating western talking points about the war [losses, ammo shortages, treason in the rear, corruption etc]. I noted that Prig was a dead man walking if this was true. Well.....
Please don't think I am being smug. It is simply that many [here] have a very genuine level of support for Russia and this tends to filter out bad news. I don't think this incident can be spun as good news in any way for the Putin regime, Shoigu and Russia. They appear to have had some sort of rat operating at senior levels. Well, we'll see how this thing pans out. The odd thing is deafening silence in the western MSM. There is a lot more to this story I think, and I am glad that karlof1 saw fit to raise the issue and publish this very good piece about it. However like the Prig saga, the real truth may never be known.
The MIC isn't specifically where the corruption occurred; it's in the construction realm which has been one of the fastest growing Russian economic sectors. Marat did a good job of describing the meaning of the arrest's theatrics, but IMO there's more to it that will be hard for non-Russians to understand. I'll be asking S at MoA about it over the weekend when he usually visits that site.
thanks for sharing this... if we juxtaposition russia to usa here, it becomes very interesting.. we are supposed to believe the usa/west is free of corruption, but most people know this is not the case.. trump is put up as the corrupt bad boy of the western political system, but biden gets a free ride.. clearly the 2 countries deal with corruption differently.. perhaps it is similar in russia as it is to the usa - those at the very top running things, remain hidden from view, but still demand a certain type of conformity to the ideals driving these 2 very different countries... perhaps more info will come out, like pepe's rumour.. until it does - it is all speculation on our part..
"clearly the 2 countries deal with corruption differently.."
In the Collective Waste we have, potentially, a host of 'Epsteined' compradors fearful of exposure who 'tow the line' regardless. Whereas, apparently, in Russia there are corrupt officials who are encouraged to walk the 'straight and narrow' by being put on notice that their financial peccadillos are known following the arrest and punishment of a high profile 'perp'.
"those at the very top running things, remain hidden from view" It seems to me that in Russia and China the people who embody 'the State' are visible and control the legislation that controls the economic and social conditions of those two nations. Whereas here in the Collective Waste, and especially the USA, the state has been captured by the Corporate Economy, which is probably international even if it may be dominated by American corporations - they are hidden from view.
It seems to me that the sinister picture painted of China, Iran, North Korea and Russia is a projection of home grown realities/illusions. As you wrote "we are supposed to believe the usa/west is free of corruption" and failure to believe will not be tolerated because lawfare is available to punish unbelievers.
Yours and james's points are important and rate an article in reply as opposed to a short comment. Within semi-socialist societies/cultures, high-level corruption can kill the state as we saw with USSR--the ruling cadre cannot become a caste/class exhibiting conspicuous consumption beyond the perks that come with governance. Jack Ma is a very good example as he was allowed to become very wealthy but not allowed to use that wealth for political purposes, nor was he allowed to flaunt it in an ostentatious manner. Putin's Russia needs to have a similar balance as the poverty rate is still about 8% and isn't being run down to zero as fast as it might because of specific factors related to Russia--many are indigenous Arctic dwellers still living their societal pathways. Meanwhile, the West tries with all its might to project its massive wealth-gap onto other nations in an effort to destabilize--for example, Putin wears a Rolex that was presented to him 20 years ago that Western propaganda tries to use to show he has "corrupt earnings." As I wrote a few years ago, Putin has all the assets of the Russian state at his disposal, so why does he need to risk his standing by breaking the social code. Hell, the Bidens, et al, all belong in prison as their corruption is general public knowledge that the system prevents them from being tried and sentenced.
Those that know their Russian history will know of the systemic corruption present within the Tsar's Era that was never solved during the Communist Era and caused its implosion. The difference between those Eras and now is Putin's understanding of them and their very negative affect on society. Just look at the confidence rating polls where Putin is highly esteemed versus the local municipal people who are sub 50%. Yet, as Putin says, there's still lots of work to do.
you might be right about this lantern dude... yours is a great comment either way.. perhaps their are no controlling forces hidden from view with regard to russia and china.. that would be a real difference from what we have here in the west if so...
Cheers james. That's the second thing to cheer me up this evening. I've just listened to Nima and Dimtry Orlov and he always makes me smile - with the occassional guffaw - with his irreverent analysis.
well you have to credit him for his transparency!! the others are trying to do the same, but are less verbose about it! i guess that is why they call trump a blowhard, lol...
For some intriguing information and history it is worth considering a few of the astounding posts at slavlandchronicles.substack.com
There you will find some interesting material to ponder as we approach the reveal of the new Putin Ministerial lineup. Now, where is Sergey Surovikin these days and has he endured sufficient penance?
I'll be interested to read as it's crucial that each of the BRICS+ take measures to moderate their own similar issues as this is a vector the money power has plenty of experience exploiting. I understand the President Xi has been dealing with similar issues in China which is hardly surprising given the magnitude of increased wealth in the PRC.
I see corruption as a social disease that exists everywhere regardless the level of wealth and is a very longstanding problem related to the breakdown in culture as the main regulator of behavior within human societies. As such, its genesis appears to begin with the advent of material accumulation that occurred when humans began semi-settled communities about 15,000 years ago. Some cultures adapted methods to contain and regulate what would become a problem while others failed--such cultural adaptations usually take many generations to instill, so they can be defeated when something new arises rapidly which appears to be the case with material accumulation linked to the new agricultural mode of existence.
IMO, Russian language media is where it will be discussed and on Telegram. I'd like to try and follow it, but the volume of other happenings is rather high making it tough for me alone.
Very interesting. Corruption of course can't really exist without government, and therefore the bigger the government the bigger the potential corruption. So many like to assume that Russia is the lead in the resistance, a Christian state of morality and honesty. The West of course constantly refers to their endemic corruption. The Russians are obviously well aware of their corruption issue but have their own way of dealing with it, seems don't cross the line to disloyalty or get overly greedy and you are allowed to continue, if not then arrested. This of course could be interpreted that stealing a bit is OK but not so as to damage the state, as such how high does it go?
We in the West of course liked to pretend that corruption was negligible, whereas the truth of course is that it also is endemic. I found interesting the Russian observation that if all the corrupt were arrested then there would be no one left to run the state, Russia at least is trying to chip away at it, we though are still drowning in it with no end currently in sight. Needless to say the financiers that run the world set the example to all below to steal all you can get your hands on, just as they do.
Did you note the specific nature given of the two forms of theft? As here inside the Outlaw US Empire, the theft is from all the people except for those doing the thieving--very little is theft from the government--whereas theft from the people is considered very evil in Russia. Stealing from the state isn't as bad but depends on the category of what's being stolen.
It's a very good point. Endangering the lives of your soldiers, delivery of social services like Health, Education, pensions. When you've undermined this trust it's a slippery slope. It's funny in my experience having an annual anti-corruption test to pass, not one doughnut, but for politicians, not so much awareness.
"Of course, we now have a huge crime with the theft of Russia’s frozen assets that became that way due to another crime, the illegal sanctions regime"
I read somewhere this am that Russia has frozen $400+B in assets of iirc JP Morgan. Forget where...looking now.
Andrei Martyanov mentioned it today, it was at RT here's the link: https://www.rt.com/business/596568-russian-court-orders-seizure-jpmorgan-funds/
Phew. Ty. I looked all over the place. Ran out of time!
A lot of people on these sites/blogs seem to believe that Russia can do no wrong and all the sins of the world reside in the West and/or Israel. So it is good to read of the endemic corruption with the Russian MIC, though I am still perplexed as to why in this case it was treated as "treason" rather than "business as usual". Well, he has been very publically arrested so no doubt we will find out. Perhaps the truth (or at least what we are told) will upset some of the readership here - at least in the sense that it won't fit with their view of Russia and its internal affairs?
When Prig went off the rails and launched his infamous 24 hour rebellion there was much debate in the blogosphere about whether this was a tantrum, 5D chess, a CIA backed coup or something else. I said at the time it was a western backed coup - given the timing and Prig's very public statements repeating western talking points about the war [losses, ammo shortages, treason in the rear, corruption etc]. I noted that Prig was a dead man walking if this was true. Well.....
Please don't think I am being smug. It is simply that many [here] have a very genuine level of support for Russia and this tends to filter out bad news. I don't think this incident can be spun as good news in any way for the Putin regime, Shoigu and Russia. They appear to have had some sort of rat operating at senior levels. Well, we'll see how this thing pans out. The odd thing is deafening silence in the western MSM. There is a lot more to this story I think, and I am glad that karlof1 saw fit to raise the issue and publish this very good piece about it. However like the Prig saga, the real truth may never be known.
The MIC isn't specifically where the corruption occurred; it's in the construction realm which has been one of the fastest growing Russian economic sectors. Marat did a good job of describing the meaning of the arrest's theatrics, but IMO there's more to it that will be hard for non-Russians to understand. I'll be asking S at MoA about it over the weekend when he usually visits that site.
There is articles in Western MSM today. I found 30 articles in news aggregator Ground.news
Thanks for pointing that out, though earlier my usual sources where indeed silent. Maybe it is my sources?
Not read yet…..the most amusing aspect is his first name: Timur. One of my favourite childhood books was — Timur and his party 😎
Тимур и его партия
thanks for sharing this... if we juxtaposition russia to usa here, it becomes very interesting.. we are supposed to believe the usa/west is free of corruption, but most people know this is not the case.. trump is put up as the corrupt bad boy of the western political system, but biden gets a free ride.. clearly the 2 countries deal with corruption differently.. perhaps it is similar in russia as it is to the usa - those at the very top running things, remain hidden from view, but still demand a certain type of conformity to the ideals driving these 2 very different countries... perhaps more info will come out, like pepe's rumour.. until it does - it is all speculation on our part..
"clearly the 2 countries deal with corruption differently.."
In the Collective Waste we have, potentially, a host of 'Epsteined' compradors fearful of exposure who 'tow the line' regardless. Whereas, apparently, in Russia there are corrupt officials who are encouraged to walk the 'straight and narrow' by being put on notice that their financial peccadillos are known following the arrest and punishment of a high profile 'perp'.
"those at the very top running things, remain hidden from view" It seems to me that in Russia and China the people who embody 'the State' are visible and control the legislation that controls the economic and social conditions of those two nations. Whereas here in the Collective Waste, and especially the USA, the state has been captured by the Corporate Economy, which is probably international even if it may be dominated by American corporations - they are hidden from view.
It seems to me that the sinister picture painted of China, Iran, North Korea and Russia is a projection of home grown realities/illusions. As you wrote "we are supposed to believe the usa/west is free of corruption" and failure to believe will not be tolerated because lawfare is available to punish unbelievers.
Yours and james's points are important and rate an article in reply as opposed to a short comment. Within semi-socialist societies/cultures, high-level corruption can kill the state as we saw with USSR--the ruling cadre cannot become a caste/class exhibiting conspicuous consumption beyond the perks that come with governance. Jack Ma is a very good example as he was allowed to become very wealthy but not allowed to use that wealth for political purposes, nor was he allowed to flaunt it in an ostentatious manner. Putin's Russia needs to have a similar balance as the poverty rate is still about 8% and isn't being run down to zero as fast as it might because of specific factors related to Russia--many are indigenous Arctic dwellers still living their societal pathways. Meanwhile, the West tries with all its might to project its massive wealth-gap onto other nations in an effort to destabilize--for example, Putin wears a Rolex that was presented to him 20 years ago that Western propaganda tries to use to show he has "corrupt earnings." As I wrote a few years ago, Putin has all the assets of the Russian state at his disposal, so why does he need to risk his standing by breaking the social code. Hell, the Bidens, et al, all belong in prison as their corruption is general public knowledge that the system prevents them from being tried and sentenced.
Those that know their Russian history will know of the systemic corruption present within the Tsar's Era that was never solved during the Communist Era and caused its implosion. The difference between those Eras and now is Putin's understanding of them and their very negative affect on society. Just look at the confidence rating polls where Putin is highly esteemed versus the local municipal people who are sub 50%. Yet, as Putin says, there's still lots of work to do.
Look forward to it. IMO what Putin and his team are building - or at least attempting to construct - is both epic and admirable.
you might be right about this lantern dude... yours is a great comment either way.. perhaps their are no controlling forces hidden from view with regard to russia and china.. that would be a real difference from what we have here in the west if so...
Cheers james. That's the second thing to cheer me up this evening. I've just listened to Nima and Dimtry Orlov and he always makes me smile - with the occassional guffaw - with his irreverent analysis.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HpzaXUww-K0 should you be interested the final bit about Trump is priceless.
Trump said he'll sanction any nation refusing to use the dollar, which is a massive howler.
well you have to credit him for his transparency!! the others are trying to do the same, but are less verbose about it! i guess that is why they call trump a blowhard, lol...
For some intriguing information and history it is worth considering a few of the astounding posts at slavlandchronicles.substack.com
There you will find some interesting material to ponder as we approach the reveal of the new Putin Ministerial lineup. Now, where is Sergey Surovikin these days and has he endured sufficient penance?
I'll be interested to read as it's crucial that each of the BRICS+ take measures to moderate their own similar issues as this is a vector the money power has plenty of experience exploiting. I understand the President Xi has been dealing with similar issues in China which is hardly surprising given the magnitude of increased wealth in the PRC.
I see corruption as a social disease that exists everywhere regardless the level of wealth and is a very longstanding problem related to the breakdown in culture as the main regulator of behavior within human societies. As such, its genesis appears to begin with the advent of material accumulation that occurred when humans began semi-settled communities about 15,000 years ago. Some cultures adapted methods to contain and regulate what would become a problem while others failed--such cultural adaptations usually take many generations to instill, so they can be defeated when something new arises rapidly which appears to be the case with material accumulation linked to the new agricultural mode of existence.
This will be interesting to follow. It hasn’t seemed to deter what’s been happening on the various fronts.
IMO, Russian language media is where it will be discussed and on Telegram. I'd like to try and follow it, but the volume of other happenings is rather high making it tough for me alone.
Thank you!