Yet again, we get schooled by the dominant diplomatic teacher of our Era via Foreign Minister Sergey Lavrov's interview with the Belarusian News Agency that took place in Minsk on 28 October.
Instructive to compare Mr. Lavrov's thoughtful and nuanced statements to those of, say, Blinken, Baerbock, Colonnade, von der Crazy or Borrel. One is an educated adult, the others hysterical high-school kids. The West is done. The East is ascendent.
Lavrov understands, as does most of the sentient world, including our clever selves, that the Two State solution has passed its 'Sell By' date.
It is also understood, though, that Israel is pledged to negotiate a Palestinian State solution and has been for a very long time. Its a fiction but its a legal fiction.
We all know that the Israelis have been making excuse after excuse for not fulfilling the pledges that they made at Camp David, in Oslo and elsewhere. And that the US has covered for them. But the fact remains that the entire architecture of Middle East relations is founded on the fiction that Israel wants peace and will negotiate a fair settlement for the Palestinians.
They promised Sadat- that was the basis of the Peace with Egypt. And they promised King Hussein of Jordan.
What Lavrov is doing is reminding the world of those promises and calling for the parties to honour them. That puts the ball in Israel's court. Will it confess to the world, as Poroshenko Hollande and Merkel did over Minsk, that it has just been playing for time, hoping that the Palestinians would disappear and killing them, impoverishing them , intimidating them to ensure that they do?
In a sense, through the boasts of the bigoted clowns who are part of the Cabinet in Tel Aviv, they already have. But it remains for Israel to come clean- that's why Lavrov (diplomatically feigning ignorance0 keeps on sasking the Israelis when they are going to make peace.
He knows the answer but until they say openly that they want the whole of Palestine and half of Syria and the Sinai plus much of Lebanion too, it is diplomatic to play dumb.
Play dumb and build up the forces that are going to be needed. Perhaps very soon.
Thank you bevin. Methinks the Zionist plan to take all through gradual accumulation and occasional snatch and grab has failed mightily. Yes, they can still sting but the Arab neighbours have acquired mighty skill and much technology over the past 70 years. Equally the major occupants to the east of the vast eurasian island have transformed their global alliances such that they may just have sufficient capacity to shut down the relentless thieving aggression. I live in hope of course. Stay well brother.
Netanyahu with his map flourishing before the entire world at the UNGA last month confirmed "they want the whole of Palestine," and the incessant chatter by the ultra-radicals on the record about their goal gives away what was always known but never really acknowledged. Crooke alerted us to this last June well before the UNGA as I documented.
There's only one solution when dealing with those who lie and refuse to honor their commitments as Russia has discovered in Ukraine, which is as artificial a construct as is Occupied Palestine. And that's the trap constructed long ago by the Zionist Project itself, not Hamas--a war that will consume the region because the Imperialists have really wanted that to happen all along so they can profit from the riches they'll gain via victory.
Response to Karl Sanchez' "More Elucidation from Lavrov"
" In the absence of a state, Israel will be a constant threat from there."
Brian Berletic and Angelo Guiliano discussed this exact point on their live show. Angelo pointed out that the Zionist enterprise would collapse quickly if Palestine had an independent state which did not threaten Israel. The Zionists can only function if there is an external threat. This is precisely the reason the Zionists always refuse to negotiate and continue the pressure on the Palestinians. They need to keep the Palestinians angry so they can convince the Israeli population that they are the ones protecting the Israelis from being "destroyed in a new Holocaust".
When, of course, in reality, they are courting and precipitating a "new Holocaust" as we see in the current situation, which has been developing for 100 years, even before the Holocaust.
As I am on record for many years, the notion of a separate Palestinian state is absurd. First, it continues to propagate the basic illegal mechanism of the original Jewish occupation resulting from the UN partition and the recognition of the Israeli state.
Second, it will permit Israel to legally destroy and drive the Palestinians out of the rest of Palestine the minute some extremist in the new Palestine state throws a rock over the border and hits an Israeli guard on their side. Then Israel can start a war and claim innocence because they are not attacking an "occupied people" but another state.
It's sad that the Russians haven't figured this out. Apparently they are as beat down by the issue as the British were in 1947 when they wanted to wash their hands of the region and dumped it in the UN's lap. No one has the will to put forth the correct solution: the reversal of the 1947 partition and the 1948 recognition of the Israeli state and in its place the creation of a bi-national state.
And the reason no one does so is because, in the last analysis, no one cares about the situation or the Palestinians - until it threatens to start WWIII. Despite all the gushing about the morality of the issue on all sides, in the end, people care only about their own situation, not someone else's.
This is behavior seen almost everywhere in human civilization. Millions of homeless in the US are ignored. Starving people in other countries are ignored. People being imprisoned inhumanely are ignored. Racial and other forms of discrimination on a mass scale is ignored. State depredation is ignored. Meanwhile the "virtuous" loudly proclaim their "virtue" in order to confirm their status as the "Good People" and their right to judge everyone else. The hypocrisy is nauseating.
For their part, the Palestinians need to recognize this and come up with their own plan to destroy Israel. Hamas has the right idea: destroy the Israeli state. They just have no real plan and poor execution of the one they have. The Palestinian Authority are just lap dogs insuring their complicity with Israeli in their own persecution. A comparison could be made between the US NAACP and the Black Panthers could be made.
And all this because of some religious lunacy on both sides which underscores the primitive level of the human mind. Until that is fixed, nothing will improve in human civilization. As people like Robert Anton Wilson used to ask, "Is this a tragedy or a comedy?"
Agreed, which is why IMO a wider war will come. However, I do think the Russians also see that as happening and have discussed that with all their allies. There are many things Lavrov's privy to that we're never told. Here's what Medvedev wrote on his Telegram yesterday:
Israel has been postponing its ground operation in Gaza all the time. Mostly under pressure from the US and fearing the wrath of the world.
But don't be fooled. The operation will take place, and with the most severe bloody consequences. Moloch always demands more and more victims, and the machine of mutual violence will now work for years.
In addition, the West is very tired of Ukraine. And he enthusiastically took up the support of Israel. Even the new Speaker of the US House of Representatives, Michael Jackson (sorry, Mike Johnson, but who cares) named assistance to Tel Aviv as his first act.
Or maybe it would be better to resume the Middle East settlement process and finally try to implement UN Security Council Resolution 22 of November 11, 67? Or even the original Palestine Partition Plan, adopted on November 242, 29 by UN General Assembly Resolution 1947?
The questions are, of course, rhetorical.
After all, it is much more interesting to divide the loot into someone else's war far from the United States.
Yeah, I saw that Medvedev statement. The important point, though, is that no one - including the Russians - are prepared to state what actually should be done to actually solve the issue.
Because no one can without being dismissed as a lunatic - or worse, someone who threatens the concept of the state. Because the only way to resolve the Palestine issue is to revoke the charter of a state and the so-called "self-determination of a people." Because the Zionists are not "a people" - they are occupiers, colonialists, imperialists, fascists and terrorists.
So what needs to happen is a bi-national state (as an anarchist, I'd prefer a "bi-national region", of course). But that requires revoking one state to start another. And no one dares to do that because what happens if it catches on? Who's next? Kosovo? Ukraine?
I, of course, don't care if I'm considered a lunatic. I'm with The Joker on that. :-) "
“They Laugh At Me Because I'm Different. I laugh At Then Because They're all the same”
“They say I act like I don't give a f*ck....I tell them I'm not acting.”
Thanks uncle! I felt Pepe's piece was a good complement to mine. I wish I had a better direct line to him. I left several comments at his VK, and I know he's as busy as I am. So far Hamas is handling the initial Zionist assault well, embarrassing several of their attempted assaults. Meanwhile, Hezbollah slowly attrits the Zionists on the Northern Front. As I wrote at Simplicius's, this is a dual siege, the one attacking Occupied Palestine is logistical and financial and will prove more harmful than the siege on Gaza.
The diplomatic challenge is to define an achievable near term outcome with a viable long-term outlook. There are not many adults in that room where memes populate the leading lines of thought. The UN, IMHO, has been trying, somewhat to my surprise. Perhaps it is a good start, worth staying with it for its intended course. The US and its toadies are not on board. I am not clear on who speaks for the Arab or Palestinian community. The immediate need is for adults.
Frankly, you cannot try to understand why actors in this struggle do such perplexing things while ignoring it is about the wealth that lies silently pulling the levers. One comes up confused and flummoxed by the choices of the US and Israel when trying to map onto their behavior a moral code or concept of right and wrong.
When you look at the power apparatus as a cold machine always choosing to protect its self interest without a shred of empathy, it isn't that difficult to predict what comes next. It isn't individuals doing it either. Think of the collective action of the super-influential as a mindless disease that always grows and metastasizes to grow and insulate its self interest.
The movie "The Corporation" touched on this but I think it's bigger than that.
IMO, the Russians are well aware of the forces you describe and allude to them occasionally but not constantly, which causes consternation in folks like yourself who don't watch/follow as closely as people like myself. Dr. Hudson is a good example of that as he's talked about what he terms the Donors so often he assumes people have that prior knowledge but all too often don't. Being repetitive is annoying to presenters but needs to be overcome. I'm surely guilty of that occasionally too despite knowing better. I know those who desire grad level analysis also get frustrated when we revisit material they already know in order to provide "newbies" the information they require to get up to speed.
Yes, it's somewhat bigger. There's a podcast featuring Bill Black and Michael Hudson where they go no holds barred and say matter-of-factly that Wall Street OWNS all three branches of the Federal Government. I asked Dr. Hudson about that, and he confirmed that's exactly what they said and meant. He details the overall mechanism in "Killing the Host", and we've mapped out the basic overall historical gestation of that parasitic system and its practitioners. My VK site has more writings about it than here, but that will change as I wrote more.
Instructive to compare Mr. Lavrov's thoughtful and nuanced statements to those of, say, Blinken, Baerbock, Colonnade, von der Crazy or Borrel. One is an educated adult, the others hysterical high-school kids. The West is done. The East is ascendent.
Sad, but true.
Western leadership is full of nitwits and halfwits, arrogant as all can be.
Lavrov understands, as does most of the sentient world, including our clever selves, that the Two State solution has passed its 'Sell By' date.
It is also understood, though, that Israel is pledged to negotiate a Palestinian State solution and has been for a very long time. Its a fiction but its a legal fiction.
We all know that the Israelis have been making excuse after excuse for not fulfilling the pledges that they made at Camp David, in Oslo and elsewhere. And that the US has covered for them. But the fact remains that the entire architecture of Middle East relations is founded on the fiction that Israel wants peace and will negotiate a fair settlement for the Palestinians.
They promised Sadat- that was the basis of the Peace with Egypt. And they promised King Hussein of Jordan.
What Lavrov is doing is reminding the world of those promises and calling for the parties to honour them. That puts the ball in Israel's court. Will it confess to the world, as Poroshenko Hollande and Merkel did over Minsk, that it has just been playing for time, hoping that the Palestinians would disappear and killing them, impoverishing them , intimidating them to ensure that they do?
In a sense, through the boasts of the bigoted clowns who are part of the Cabinet in Tel Aviv, they already have. But it remains for Israel to come clean- that's why Lavrov (diplomatically feigning ignorance0 keeps on sasking the Israelis when they are going to make peace.
He knows the answer but until they say openly that they want the whole of Palestine and half of Syria and the Sinai plus much of Lebanion too, it is diplomatic to play dumb.
Play dumb and build up the forces that are going to be needed. Perhaps very soon.
Thank you bevin. Methinks the Zionist plan to take all through gradual accumulation and occasional snatch and grab has failed mightily. Yes, they can still sting but the Arab neighbours have acquired mighty skill and much technology over the past 70 years. Equally the major occupants to the east of the vast eurasian island have transformed their global alliances such that they may just have sufficient capacity to shut down the relentless thieving aggression. I live in hope of course. Stay well brother.
Netanyahu with his map flourishing before the entire world at the UNGA last month confirmed "they want the whole of Palestine," and the incessant chatter by the ultra-radicals on the record about their goal gives away what was always known but never really acknowledged. Crooke alerted us to this last June well before the UNGA as I documented.
There's only one solution when dealing with those who lie and refuse to honor their commitments as Russia has discovered in Ukraine, which is as artificial a construct as is Occupied Palestine. And that's the trap constructed long ago by the Zionist Project itself, not Hamas--a war that will consume the region because the Imperialists have really wanted that to happen all along so they can profit from the riches they'll gain via victory.
Response to Karl Sanchez' "More Elucidation from Lavrov"
" In the absence of a state, Israel will be a constant threat from there."
Brian Berletic and Angelo Guiliano discussed this exact point on their live show. Angelo pointed out that the Zionist enterprise would collapse quickly if Palestine had an independent state which did not threaten Israel. The Zionists can only function if there is an external threat. This is precisely the reason the Zionists always refuse to negotiate and continue the pressure on the Palestinians. They need to keep the Palestinians angry so they can convince the Israeli population that they are the ones protecting the Israelis from being "destroyed in a new Holocaust".
When, of course, in reality, they are courting and precipitating a "new Holocaust" as we see in the current situation, which has been developing for 100 years, even before the Holocaust.
As I am on record for many years, the notion of a separate Palestinian state is absurd. First, it continues to propagate the basic illegal mechanism of the original Jewish occupation resulting from the UN partition and the recognition of the Israeli state.
Second, it will permit Israel to legally destroy and drive the Palestinians out of the rest of Palestine the minute some extremist in the new Palestine state throws a rock over the border and hits an Israeli guard on their side. Then Israel can start a war and claim innocence because they are not attacking an "occupied people" but another state.
It's sad that the Russians haven't figured this out. Apparently they are as beat down by the issue as the British were in 1947 when they wanted to wash their hands of the region and dumped it in the UN's lap. No one has the will to put forth the correct solution: the reversal of the 1947 partition and the 1948 recognition of the Israeli state and in its place the creation of a bi-national state.
And the reason no one does so is because, in the last analysis, no one cares about the situation or the Palestinians - until it threatens to start WWIII. Despite all the gushing about the morality of the issue on all sides, in the end, people care only about their own situation, not someone else's.
This is behavior seen almost everywhere in human civilization. Millions of homeless in the US are ignored. Starving people in other countries are ignored. People being imprisoned inhumanely are ignored. Racial and other forms of discrimination on a mass scale is ignored. State depredation is ignored. Meanwhile the "virtuous" loudly proclaim their "virtue" in order to confirm their status as the "Good People" and their right to judge everyone else. The hypocrisy is nauseating.
For their part, the Palestinians need to recognize this and come up with their own plan to destroy Israel. Hamas has the right idea: destroy the Israeli state. They just have no real plan and poor execution of the one they have. The Palestinian Authority are just lap dogs insuring their complicity with Israeli in their own persecution. A comparison could be made between the US NAACP and the Black Panthers could be made.
And all this because of some religious lunacy on both sides which underscores the primitive level of the human mind. Until that is fixed, nothing will improve in human civilization. As people like Robert Anton Wilson used to ask, "Is this a tragedy or a comedy?"
Agreed, which is why IMO a wider war will come. However, I do think the Russians also see that as happening and have discussed that with all their allies. There are many things Lavrov's privy to that we're never told. Here's what Medvedev wrote on his Telegram yesterday:
Israel has been postponing its ground operation in Gaza all the time. Mostly under pressure from the US and fearing the wrath of the world.
But don't be fooled. The operation will take place, and with the most severe bloody consequences. Moloch always demands more and more victims, and the machine of mutual violence will now work for years.
In addition, the West is very tired of Ukraine. And he enthusiastically took up the support of Israel. Even the new Speaker of the US House of Representatives, Michael Jackson (sorry, Mike Johnson, but who cares) named assistance to Tel Aviv as his first act.
Or maybe it would be better to resume the Middle East settlement process and finally try to implement UN Security Council Resolution 22 of November 11, 67? Or even the original Palestine Partition Plan, adopted on November 242, 29 by UN General Assembly Resolution 1947?
The questions are, of course, rhetorical.
After all, it is much more interesting to divide the loot into someone else's war far from the United States.
The war must go on...
Yeah, I saw that Medvedev statement. The important point, though, is that no one - including the Russians - are prepared to state what actually should be done to actually solve the issue.
Because no one can without being dismissed as a lunatic - or worse, someone who threatens the concept of the state. Because the only way to resolve the Palestine issue is to revoke the charter of a state and the so-called "self-determination of a people." Because the Zionists are not "a people" - they are occupiers, colonialists, imperialists, fascists and terrorists.
So what needs to happen is a bi-national state (as an anarchist, I'd prefer a "bi-national region", of course). But that requires revoking one state to start another. And no one dares to do that because what happens if it catches on? Who's next? Kosovo? Ukraine?
I, of course, don't care if I'm considered a lunatic. I'm with The Joker on that. :-) "
“They Laugh At Me Because I'm Different. I laugh At Then Because They're all the same”
“They say I act like I don't give a f*ck....I tell them I'm not acting.”
John Helmer has a short article that says Israel and US will lose if the Gaza fighting drags on.
https://johnhelmer.org/the-gods-are-going-against-the-chosen-people-mammon-against-israel-mars-against-the-pentagon/
Thank you karlof1, that was a golden prose from the great and good Lavrov. There is also an excellent report by Pepe the peripatetic journalist at the Cradle.: https://new.thecradle.co/articles/iran-russia-set-a-western-trap-in-palestine
Well worth the reading in conjunction with yours. It is good news week yet again. Stay well and happy comrade.
Thanks uncle! I felt Pepe's piece was a good complement to mine. I wish I had a better direct line to him. I left several comments at his VK, and I know he's as busy as I am. So far Hamas is handling the initial Zionist assault well, embarrassing several of their attempted assaults. Meanwhile, Hezbollah slowly attrits the Zionists on the Northern Front. As I wrote at Simplicius's, this is a dual siege, the one attacking Occupied Palestine is logistical and financial and will prove more harmful than the siege on Gaza.
The diplomatic challenge is to define an achievable near term outcome with a viable long-term outlook. There are not many adults in that room where memes populate the leading lines of thought. The UN, IMHO, has been trying, somewhat to my surprise. Perhaps it is a good start, worth staying with it for its intended course. The US and its toadies are not on board. I am not clear on who speaks for the Arab or Palestinian community. The immediate need is for adults.
Yes, well educated, enlightened adults with open minds and the ability to think outside boxes.
Frankly, you cannot try to understand why actors in this struggle do such perplexing things while ignoring it is about the wealth that lies silently pulling the levers. One comes up confused and flummoxed by the choices of the US and Israel when trying to map onto their behavior a moral code or concept of right and wrong.
When you look at the power apparatus as a cold machine always choosing to protect its self interest without a shred of empathy, it isn't that difficult to predict what comes next. It isn't individuals doing it either. Think of the collective action of the super-influential as a mindless disease that always grows and metastasizes to grow and insulate its self interest.
The movie "The Corporation" touched on this but I think it's bigger than that.
IMO, the Russians are well aware of the forces you describe and allude to them occasionally but not constantly, which causes consternation in folks like yourself who don't watch/follow as closely as people like myself. Dr. Hudson is a good example of that as he's talked about what he terms the Donors so often he assumes people have that prior knowledge but all too often don't. Being repetitive is annoying to presenters but needs to be overcome. I'm surely guilty of that occasionally too despite knowing better. I know those who desire grad level analysis also get frustrated when we revisit material they already know in order to provide "newbies" the information they require to get up to speed.
Yes, it's somewhat bigger. There's a podcast featuring Bill Black and Michael Hudson where they go no holds barred and say matter-of-factly that Wall Street OWNS all three branches of the Federal Government. I asked Dr. Hudson about that, and he confirmed that's exactly what they said and meant. He details the overall mechanism in "Killing the Host", and we've mapped out the basic overall historical gestation of that parasitic system and its practitioners. My VK site has more writings about it than here, but that will change as I wrote more.
On Lavrov again: here is John Helmer at gorilla radio expounding on the domestic politics within Russia and the "israeli question". 58 minutes of focussed insight for my comrades at karlof's bar; https://gorilla-radio.com/2023/10/30/gorilla-radio-with-chris-cook-john-helmer-extended-october-29-2023/