Putin, Delovaya Rossiya (Business Russia) & Russian Governments Converse

The main topic of the discussion is ensuring balanced economic development in the context of structural transformation. A very long, important read.

A very important distinction is made at the outset of this meeting that involves not just these key business representatives, but national and regional government members linked by video. Here within the Outlaw US Empire and the West generally the Class War is being escalated via various manifestations whereas the exact opposite is happening within Russia. The following is an excerpt from Putin’s opening words:

It is very important that you, the vast majority of your colleagues, and all of us understand that professional labor collectives stand behind you. It is all together, together with them—with employees, with labor collectives–-as I have already said, and I want to emphasize this again—as one team, that you–-I want to say here—write both the success story of your business and the success story of the Russian economy. [My Emphasis]

Mr. Putin’s words were further emphasized by the Chairman of Delovaya Rossiya Alexey Repik:

Alexey Repik: Yes, Mr President, I know how important this is for our teams, how much we support each of our guys, and we expect them to come back to work, because our teams are waiting for them.

But the most important thing is that, despite the fact that some of our guys are now engaged in the defense of our Homeland, we still have everything in order with the rear. [My Emphasis]

Who are those “50-60 thousand” who come every month voluntarily to enlist in Russia’s military? Many “come by themselves, including from your labor collectives:” It’s the Russian working man who is doing the fighting and dying to preserve Russia. The labor collectives are what really make Russian business and agriculture work. An extremely small number of nations honor their workers and soldiers as Russia does, and most certainly not anywhere in the Western world where they exist to be exploited and feed the rich. One might say such recognition is a Soviet Era leftover. However, I would say that’s the only right and proper way to run a nation that’s supposed to be a collective of peoples, not a jumbled mass of Classes ruled by oligarchs. The inclusion of labor into Russia’s societal formula is the significant point needing to be made over and over because it’s so different and the aim of Russophobic Media is to erase that very significant difference and model to others. The Meeting:

Vladimir Putin: Good afternoon!

The head of Delovaya Rossiya [Alexey Repik] and I discussed how your work is going. Delovaya Rossiya is one of our leading public organizations that unites both owners and managers of manufacturing, industrial, service, and high-tech businesses in the country.

Your companies are actively strengthening their positions in the domestic market, building cooperative ties with Russian and foreign partners, and, of course, developing promising export destinations.

I would like to note that it is largely thanks to the efforts of business and the energy of entrepreneurial labor that the Russian economy is showing stability and developing. So, despite all the difficulties, despite the so-called external pressure, we still achieved significant growth in the year before last–-in general, significant growth both for our country and for the world economy: in the year before last, GDP grew by 4.1 percent, and last year–-4.3. We thought it was 4.1 percent, but after an additional calculation, it turned out to be [4.3 percent]. Those two-tenths of a percent also matter.

This is, indeed, the result of joint, partnership work of the state, business and labor collectives. A kind of fusion of entrepreneurial freedom, initiative, and skills of workers, engineers, and specialists in various fields. I hope that both the Government and our regional teams have made a certain contribution here. All together, this is the result of a common work.

It is very important that you, the vast majority of your colleagues, and all of us understand that professional labor collectives stand behind you. It is all together, together with them—with employees, with labor collectives–-as I have already said, and I want to emphasize this again—as one team, that you–-I want to say here—write both the success story of your business and the success story of the Russian economy.

A significant mission of Delovaya Rossiya is to identify barriers that hinder the dynamic growth of the domestic economy, and therefore the entire country in all areas that are important for the state. And at the same time, it is not only necessary to talk about problems, but it is also necessary to offer concrete solutions based on the daily practical experience of companies, on deep expert and legal analysis.

As a matter of fact, this is what always happens when Alexey Yevgenyevich [Repik] was there, he already touched on certain things, certain problems. Of course, you are here to discuss all this, to bring it to the attention of government agencies. Now we have many of my colleagues from various ministries, departments, and government officials in touch online–-and I hope that I will turn the arrow to them when I have any questions.

As a matter of fact, this is true-–you work out solutions together with them. If something is missing–-this is what we are going to do, in order to clarify what is missing and what needs and can be done in order to move more efficiently further.

We are hosting a plenary session of the forum. The regions in the online system are also in touch with us. So there is an opportunity to socialize and talk. I would like to hear, of course, as I have already said, questions and suggestions, which is the most important thing.

Finally, in a month's time, in June, the St. Petersburg Economic Forum will be held. I hope that the proposals that we will discuss today, and you will formulate them, will also be in demand as part of the preparations for this large-scale event.

Please, let's get started.

A word to Alexey Yevgenyevich Repik. I ask you to.

Alexey: Thank you very much, Vladimir Vladimirovich!

We have just a few days ago died down fireworks. Everyone celebrated the 80th anniversary of the Great Victory with bated breath. We honored veterans, thanked home front workers–-those who were able to mobilize during the most difficult time for the country, provided unprecedented support to the front, the work of factories, factories, transport infrastructure, schools, hospitals.

And now, when the neo-Nazis who raised their heads with the support, and often under the dictation of their curators, have crossed the boundaries of what is permissible, moved the hybrid war from the economic board to the battlefield, it seems to me that right now it is important to once again thank and express great gratitude on behalf of all Russian entrepreneurs to our defenders of the Fatherland, participants of the special military operation for their military work, heroism. This is very important for us.

Mr President, you can be absolutely sure: just like 80 years ago, the rear is secured.

Vladimir Putin: I'm sorry. You just spoke about defenders, about those who are engaged in military work. I must say, I want to point this out too, sorry, for God's sake, I won't interrupt any more, but this is very important–-after all, these are also people from your labor collectives.

I want to draw your attention to this: if the Kiev authorities are engaged in forced mobilization--people are caught on the street like dogs, then our guys go voluntarily, they go themselves. We have a set, you know: they are currently catching 30 thousand people there, and we have 50-60 thousand people a month who come by themselves, including from your labor collectives. So thank you for remembering this.

Alexey Repik: Yes, Mr President, I know how important this is for our teams, how much we support each of our guys, and we expect them to come back to work, because our teams are waiting for them.

But the most important thing is that, despite the fact that some of our guys are now engaged in the defense of our Homeland, we still have everything in order with the rear. We also managed to mobilize, set up production, put everything we needed on the front line, while maintaining the possibility of a normal daily life. In other words, the teams got used to these endless sanctions "bombardments", of course, they missed strikes somewhere, stalled, but they learned to correct mistakes and adapt quickly. And now, in general, I am confident that the economic security circuit is reliably protected.

Mr President, our meeting is taking place at a very special time. Around the upcoming possible negotiations, well-known comrades will again plot their machinations, intimidate us with the introduction of hundredth or five-hundredth packages of sanctions and frighten us with apocalypses. You can immediately say: it won't work. We did it in 2022, and we will do it now.

It is always very important at the key points of the story, but it is also easy to determine who is really who. Vysotsky had it like this:"If you idly watched down and did not fight with the scoundrel, with the executioner, then you had nothing to do with life." Here is what is important: "Delovaya Rossiya", the entrepreneurs of "Delovaya Rossiya" at the most critical moment did not get scared, did not vibrate, balancing both yours and ours, did not try to escape somewhere. We calmly and confidently stood up, as they say, to our full height and did our job, defending our right to sovereign development, our right to live as we see fit, and do what we do right on the labor front. I would like to confirm once again, Mr President, that you can rest assured that whatever the pressure, we have secured the economic security circuit.

You mentioned that a number of topics for discussion were discussed during the preparations for the congress. More specific industry and regional issues and suggestions will be made today from our speakers, but there are two blocks that concern almost every one of us.

The first is monetary policy and maintaining investment activity. Here, of course, it is very important to remind everyone how critical it is not to miss the moment when efforts to combat inflation will start to give a sharp return and the economy will "fall" into hypothermia from overheating. We're just seeing the first signs of it. These are not only our unexpected May frosts, but also a number of serious indicators.

See: the producer price index, and in processing, including, not only in the energy sector, is falling, that is, prices are falling. Further, the corporate loan portfolio decreased by 40 billion rubles in the first four months. I want to remind you that last year it grew every month, adding a total of more than 14 trillion rubles. And inflation, by the way, almost stopped last week.

I will focus on the second priority block–-these are the formats for returning foreign companies to our market.

In general, foreigners initially felt privileged in the new Russia. The largest multinational corporations since the early 1990s, entering the Russian market, felt at ease: they received the most convenient sites for construction, the best places in shopping centers, conducted massive advertising campaigns, when we heard the names of brands from every iron. Thus, in fact, loyalty to these brands was formed.

We agree: Of course, foreign investments brought a lot of benefits, but our growing domestic market returned these investments a hundredfold, these investments. And so, when in 2022 many foreign investors were forced to withdraw from the Russian market or sharply reduce their presence, the domestic business found a solution, and many of these solutions turned out to be no worse, and sometimes even better than the original ones.

Vladimir Vladimirovich, no economy can develop normally and be self-sufficient. But the need to ensure technological sovereignty and readiness in a critical situation to close the most acute, significant elements of domestic consumption on their own—they are for Russia from a theoretical construction, the probability of which many were extremely skeptical--have become a reality. We really did everything in our power to deal with this situation. So now, when we hear more and more signals from our historical partners, who are also competitors, about working out a plan to return to the Russian market, fear of losing it forever, readiness to take a step forward–-this is a step back, in fact–-it is necessary to form an objective and balanced position in relation to this process.

The economy should not be shut down. Of course, we welcome companies from any country to enter our market, as well as any healthy competition. As well as, of course, we welcome foreign investment in Russian companies that have regained their home market. But as for foreign companies, it seems to us that it is inappropriate to row everyone under one comb. There are those who, despite the difficulties, pressure from their politicians, continued to work and invest with us, and they should be treated with reverence and care, as if they were our own. Others reduced their presence and left, but they did it with respect, without compromising consumers. Someone transferred the business to Russian investors, while retaining the opportunity to return. Here, the most correct format seems to us to be a return through the creation of joint ventures with Russian partners, while maintaining a certain shareholder control over the latter: either majority or through a "golden share". I believe that this format should become mandatory for enterprises in strategic industries.

Those companies that" hung the lock on the door", let down Russian contractors, did not fulfill their contractual and warranty obligations, must first compensate for the losses incurred by us, and if the damage was caused to consumers, citizens, then pay the corresponding compensation to the budget of the Russian Federation.

If we talk about companies that allowed themselves to express anti-Russian rhetoric, supported the Armed Forces of Ukraine, publicly accused Russia, refused to deal with it, no one is waiting for them in our market. The Russian consumer remembers such things very well. In general, to start a dialogue about the return of such companies, it seems to me that they will first have to make a public apology.

The time when we gave the" green light " to everything foreign to the detriment of ourselves has irrevocably passed. The internal investor should be an absolute priority for us. Where this is not the case, the situation needs to be corrected. For example, I still wonder why and whether it is fair that employees of our companies who went to work abroad for various reasons, regardless of their tax residence, were equalized at the personal income tax rate with employees in Russia in 2024. Let me remind you that earlier the "fork" was 17%.

In general, I believe that those who work, live at home, in Russia, make a much more significant contribution to our economy, spend money here, so they should be a priority. As in the case of investors, those who have fled should pay the price for their shortsightedness, and not receive preferences.

You mentioned that today, along with the speakers here in the Kremlin, we have more than 300 delegates of the congress on Delegatskaya Street in touch, as well as regional offices in all regions of the Russian Federation. Entrepreneurs of Delovaya Rossiya have a lot to say about the achievements and successes in recent years, as well as suggestions for implementing the tasks you set for structural transformation of the economy and increasing factor productivity. So, if you'll excuse me, I suggest we move on to the speeches.

Vladimir Putin: Yes, good.

If you'll excuse me, I'll also say a few words in order to comment on your speech.

You have raised an important issue. We encountered this somewhere at the turn of 2018-2019, when the agricultural sector in principle gained enough momentum for its development, and began, in fact, to cover all the basic needs of the Russian food market. And then the agricultural producers told me directly at the meetings: "Just don't let anyone back in." Because they will come with their huge subsidies: they all cheat in reality, all sign documents in the framework of the World Trade Organization (WTO), that this cannot be subsidized, this, and hidden subsidies go in huge quantities and create huge preferences, including in our market. First.

Second: places and shelves in stores. Our manufacturers will not be able to get through to the shelves from which the goods are sold out. What nonsense! How long have we talked about this? Even though the stake is on Teshi's head, nothing happens. Now, when Alexey [Repik] said that our entrepreneurs have managed to achieve a lot: and brands appear in hundreds and thousands of names, and so on and so on. And indeed, some things are better in quality than foreign manufacturers previously imagined in our market. But you know that better than anyone else. I went to the market, staked out everything, and then I couldn't kick you out. Do anything you want–-you can't break through in any way. Now they have foolishly banned their companies from working with us. But we see that people are coming to me, and big businesses are coming out, and they want to come back. For God's sake, please. But here it is very important, as Alexey [Repik] correctly said, first of all, we need to see who behaved like this. Furniture Manufacturers… In Belarus, they used to make good furniture. Well, God grant you good health. And we began to do it no worse, and maybe even better. And technologies appeared, and even the corresponding means of production appeared, and they began to make themselves.

Yes, this is a complex process. It is more complex, of course, and more diverse than in the field of agriculture, although even there everything is not so simple. By the way, the quality of our products and the requirements for agricultural products have always been higher than in the European Union, for example. But also in the field of industrial production.

Of course, you need to see who behaved like that. Someone was rude, saddened us, well, let them sit somewhere, God be with them.

What do I want to pay attention to? Alexey [Repik] said: "We need them--someone transferred money to the APU--we need them to apologize." Uh, no! This is definitely not enough. They're about to be charged. Listen, I've been in contact with many people for decades, and I've met many business representatives in Europe and the United States… I respect them very much, they are very serious people, competent, pragmatic, they can count everything, they can achieve their goals. They are really powerful competitors.

If you say, "You'll apologize," they'll apologize tomorrow. If they need to go back to our market, whatever-–they'll come and kiss you on the mouth. This is not enough. We need to look at all these issues from a pragmatic point of view. Listen to me: is it profitable for us to have this or that company come? So we should let her in. You know, I'll put it simply, in the popular way: it's not profitable-–you need to find a thousand reasons why it should not be here, this or that company. And among these thousands of reasons, 999 will exactly meet the WTO requirements, I assure you. And we will argue in the courts for one for at least 15 years.

I didn't come up with anything. You know, when someone left our market, violated our laws, violated WTO laws, we told them: "We will go to court." "Good riddance, for God's sake. We will sue you for 10, 15, 20 years." We were told this three years ago. That's what we should do with them. Nothing personal, just business.

I asked the Government to work on this issue, to work out certain conditions of return. Of course, we must take into account the behavior of our partners in the previous three years. Of course, without this, too, it is impossible, it is necessary to treat as a human being. There were companies that didn't want to, but left with tears, honestly, but with tears: "The pressure is such that they will destroy our business overseas, they will not allow us to make payments, and they will cause damage in Europe." We all know them. I asked the Government to keep this in mind.

I would now like to ask Maxim G. Reshetnikov (this is still their diocese first of all) to comment on this issue: what the Government has prepared, and if something needs to be taken into account in terms of the interests of our business, first of all, we will focus on your interests, on the interests of our business. We will have to proceed from this.

Of course, we need to see how all this will be reflected in the market. If we really need something on the market, but there is still no way (or 20 years are still ahead) for us to reach certain parameters for the production of certain product groups, we need to orient ourselves accordingly, create joint ventures, as Alexey [Repik] suggested. We must be flexible and proceed solely from our national interests.

Maxim Gennadievich, please.

Mikhail : Mr President, thank you very much for giving me the floor.

In general, we agree with Delovaya Rossiya and Alexey Yevgenyevich on our approaches, and indeed we have discussed this many times. Of course, when they return, we will be interested not only in how the companies behaved–-we agree with the approaches--but also in how our business invested. Because if our business has occupied this niche, invested, then, of course, we must give it a period for these investments to pay off.

Therefore, we will analyze the situation here, as they say, in each specific case, based on this balance of interests–-so that people who believe, and businesses who believe in the prospects, start investing in the domestic market, so that they get the necessary return on their invested capital, as they say.

However, there is a second point. We don't always have foreign companies… Let's just say that a number of companies have left and stopped supplying the products that we need here. This is especially the case with our pharmacists: a number of Western companies have left and simply those key medicines that we need on the market, stopped supplying.

But we are also not sitting here waiting for the situation to normalize. We have introduced a special mechanism, and on your instructions, we have created the necessary government commission, which, in fact, forcibly issues licenses to our companies that are ready to produce the relevant products.

At the same time, we do not violate the rights of those companies in any way. Our companies will pay the necessary deductions at a very reasonable level to Western copyright holders. These deductions go to special accounts, where, accordingly, they accumulate, and then, when the situation is, let's say, comprehensively resolved, this money can be available to Western companies. But it is very important that now our companies are already producing the necessary medicines.

We are ready to apply the same approach to other types of products. My point is that we will not sit here and wait for Western companies to deign to provide our market with some key technologies, but we are ready to work actively here.

In general, we work very closely with Delovaya Rossiya and Alexey Yevgenyevich in all these areas, and we really have common approaches.

Thank you.

(To A. Repik.)Vladimir Putin: I have a couple more thoughts on your speech. You said that no economy in the world can be self-sufficient. This is true, but we still need to understand what self-sufficiency of the economy is in the modern world. We need to understand this.

Second point. "We will not be intimidated by these new possible sanctions"–-we should not be intimidated. Anyone who starts to get scared will immediately lose everything. But it is absolutely necessary to understand what can happen, and we must be prepared for any actions of our possible future detractors.

They do many things to their own detriment. It seems that so-and-so will not be done exactly, because it harms them. But they do, you assholes—I'm sorry, please. And how? The world's leading economies are falling into recession just to hurt us. I'll buy tickets, but I won't go, as they say, to spite the conductor. What is it? So, of course, we should keep this in mind, because they can do what they say publicly.

And, of course, we must at least minimize the negative consequences for us. This is also the answer to the question of what a self–sufficient economy can be or cannot be. Everything is interconnected in the modern world, this is an obvious thing. But still, there are key points that make up one of the parameters of our economic independence and sovereignty. We must be prepared, of course, for anything.

Now, perhaps, we will move on further.

Alexey Repik: Mr President, you know, you are always very inspired when you realize that your ideas are not only yours, but they are shared by your head of state, your leader. So, to be honest, it's easier for us now.

Vladimir Putin: What I just said, you share, right?

A. Repik: Yes.

Vladimir Putin: It's nice.

Alexey Repik: We talked about investment activity today. I would like to ask Pavel Borisovich Titov, our distinguished winemaker and president of Delovaya Rossiya, to tell us what measures we need to support investment activity. We already have them, much has been done here by the Government, and the work is going well. But it seems to me that there are elements that require additional adjustment.

Pavel Borisovich.

Pavel Titov: Thank you very much.

Dear Vladimir Vladimirovich,

In the context of tight monetary policy, high inflation, and an obvious shortage of equity capital, it is becoming increasingly difficult to maintain the dynamics of investment. We strive to create conditions for its sustainable growth, especially in industries with high added value.

We propose to adjust priorities in the application of existing state support tools. We are not talking about new volumes, but rather about a finer calibration with an emphasis on enterprises that implement investment projects using their own funds or market financing.

Today, a significant part of state support comes from loans with a subsidized interest rate. But we all understand that with the growth of lending, inflationary pressures are also increasing. Concessional loans often motivate investors to keep their own capital on high-yield deposits and keep it out of business.

We believe that it is necessary to shift the focus towards non-credit support tools: these are tax mechanisms, including federal and regional investment deductions, grants, direct compensation for actual costs incurred under industry programs.

Separately, we would like to draw your attention to the federal investment tax deduction introduced earlier this year. It aims to encourage businesses to invest in expansion and modernization through income tax adjustments. However, the mechanism needs to be adjusted further.

What do we mean by that? First of all, we consider it important to consider the possibility of simultaneous application of federal and regional investment deductions. At the moment, the Tax Code does not provide for this. Lifting the current restriction is especially important for regions with active investment policies. Federal support should not exclude regional support; on the contrary, their combination can become a serious link for new projects.

It is also necessary to expand the industry coverage of the deduction, taking into account technological priorities and tasks of national projects. Now the deduction is not available for such industries as food production, medical services, transport and warehouse logistics and not only, and this is especially important for remote regions.

Based on the results of the first half of 2025, we propose to assess the relevance and effectiveness of applying the FINV [Federal Investment Tax Deduction] and, if necessary, adjust its parameters. We believe that increasing the share of non-banking and tax mechanisms will reduce the pro-inflationary effect and motivate entrepreneurs to make optimal use of their own capital.

If I may, from the general to the particular. I still represent Russian winemaking. You gave instructions for a pilot project for remote sales of Russian wine with the participation of Russian Post in 2021.

Vladimir Putin: So that the post office can still sell wine?

P. Titov: There was such an initiative. We would like to resume work on it, because it would help a lot.

Vladimir Putin: To whom?

Pavel Titov: First of all, for Russian winemakers, of course.

Thank you so much for your attention. And of course, we are waiting for you in Abrau-Durso, we have a lot of new things.

Thank you.

Vladimir Putin: Thank you. You would have rolled us something in honor of Victory Day.

P. Titov: With pleasure.

Vladimir Putin: Pavel Borisovich, you have raised the most pressing issue today, and this is understandable. This applies not only to winemaking, but also to agriculture in general. But it was clear, as we have said many times before, that we would very much like the economy to develop at the pace we need and in compliance with macroeconomic indicators. This is understandable.

And one of the main problems of today's Russian economy is high inflation. And this is a difficult task: we need to push down inflation and not create conditions–-as Alexey [Repik] just said in his speech—so as not to freeze the economy itself. It is necessary to implement a soft, small landing, which would allow for a situation in which the Central Bank would lower the key rate.

Today's main instruments are working, as you also mentioned: loans are subsidized. This means that the higher the interest rate and, accordingly, the higher the interest rate of not only the key one, but also of credit institutions, the higher the budget expenditures for this subsidy. This is understandable. And then the question arises: where is this border and what loans to subsidize? Naturally, in this case, the state should make a choice in favor of such projects that are vital for the country and for the economy. This is obvious.

Of course, first of all, these are large companies that depend on the stability of the entire economy–-we will not name them, so as not to relax them, because they will now hear: "Only to us". The other way, as you have just mentioned, is through grants or direct subsidies for the project. Not for these loans as a whole, but for the project. But in this case, the volume of these grants and loans will also be limited. This is an obvious thing.

We talked about this additional adjustment. Now I have asked Maxim Gennadyevich to speak out, as this is also his diocese in general. But in our Government, Alexander Valentinovich Novak deals with these issues through the Government leadership.

Alexander Valentinovich, I would like to ask you to comment on this issue as well.

Alexander : Mr Putin, good afternoon! Dear participants of the congress,

Indeed, today the most urgent task in the context of a tight monetary policy is to create conditions so that the volume of investment that we have achieved and its growth rates do not decrease but also fulfill your instructions in accordance with the Decree and Message: investment growth in 2030 by 60 percent.

Therefore, of course, the Government has developed measures, we have adopted a national project in accordance with your instructions "Efficient and competitive economy", a federal project specifically on investment and support measures, in which our colleagues actively participated in the development of the national project. We discussed all support measures together with Delovaya Rossiya.

We have reported to you about the subsidy mechanisms in cooperation with the Central Bank. In order to implement a joint policy aimed at reducing inflation, we also proposed to change the approaches and part of the subsidies that we used for lending to the provision of concessional loans.

Today, it is proposed to redirect them, among other things, to grants with the condition of providing and participating in capital, in investments of companies at the expense of their own funds, with incentives, including entering into an IPO. These are the tools that should make it possible to raise additional funds, including at the expense of companies ' own funds.

We understand that even this is quite difficult to do today, given the reduction in profitability at high interest rates and the reduction in profitability. However, since such tools were used less often in the past, we will encourage them and use them to a greater extent in order to ensure the achievement of the set indicators and create incentives.

It was mentioned about the investment tax deduction. Indeed, this is a new tool, the federal investment tax deduction, which was adopted starting from January 1, 2025. Previously, we had and still have an existing instrument related to investment support within the framework of regional investment tax deductions. And there is a new one, an additional one, which is still valid for several months.

We will receive the first results of its implementation sometime in June. Together with our colleagues from Delovaya Rossiya and our business partners, we will definitely analyze the results of how this tool works.

When we discussed it, Mr President, we chose exactly those seven areas of the main types of economic activity, which are primarily aimed at modernizing and developing high-tech industries, modernizing machinery and equipment. In accordance with this instrument, three percent of the total investment can be used to reduce the payment of income tax in terms of the federal component.

Taking into account the fact that there is also a regional investment tax deduction, this tool works together. We will see how these two tools can be combined in accordance with the proposals of Delovaya Rossiya in order to get the greatest effect for its implementation.

In general, we support these proposals. We will also look at the possible expansion of directions, if our individual activities are less effectively used based on the results of analysis and monitoring of this tool. Therefore, we will work closely together to make adjustments to improve the efficiency and create investment attractiveness of not only this instrument, but also in other areas as a whole.

We have a Capital Investment Rights Protection Agreement, a Project Finance Factory, concession agreements, and various other tools that have proven effective and that we are constantly improving with our business colleagues.

Thank you.

Vladimir Putin: The SPICs [special investment contracts] are the same, as well as zones with special tax regimes, administrative support, and so on, of course.

Thank you.

Alexey Repik: Mr President, three or four years ago, at our congress, Mikhail Goncharov told you about his pancakes and about issues related to public catering in the Russian Federation. Do you remember "Teremok", when Macron was still sitting, waiting, and Mikhail Petrovich still could not stop in his great enthusiasm?

They really make 35 million pancakes a year, and during this time they have already baked more than 100 million. As far as I know, we conducted an experiment with the Ministry of Finance and the Government to adjust taxation in the industry. If you don't mind?"

Vladimir Putin: Please. In my opinion, we are currently undergoing an experiment.

Mikhail Goncharov: It is almost over.

Dear Vladimir Vladimirovich, in the early 1990s, when I saw how McDonalds works, I was shocked (I was a young student then) by how this business machine works. It really set me on fire, and I wanted to create our Russian project. And in 1998, I had such a chance, just after the crisis, I once again went bankrupt and realized that I now need to realize my dream.

Vladimir Putin: I feel that all this is good for you, you look very good.

Mikhail Goncharov: Yes, the soul of the project is Russian cuisine and pancakes. Moreover, I was so eager and eager to restore what we had lost that even we address our customers as "sir" and " madam".

In 26 years of such steady, steady development, we have opened 350 restaurants, and overall business is going well. But in 2022, as you said, an experiment was conducted for medium-sized companies with a turnover of up to two billion. They were exempted from VAT and social taxes were reduced.

Vladimir Putin: Social payments.

M. Goncharov: Social insurance.

Vladimir Putin: To what level?

M. Goncharov: From 30 to 15. Yes, for three years the experiment, in general, was a success. The Ministry of Finance even officially published the results in the newspapers that tax growth, business growth, turnover growth and overall the result was positive.

But you said "denote a barrier"... There was still one barrier left. And at that moment, the decision was made for companies up to two billion. We're going out now…

Vladimir Putin: Increase it?

Mikhail Goncharov: No, I can't increase it.

Vladimir Putin: The government wants to increase it to three.

Mikhail Goncharov: It wants to increase this micro-solution. This, as far as I know, has already been agreed upon. Those companies that have now reached barrier two or three are not important, they continue to have this barrier. In other words, social taxes increase from 15 to 30 and VAT immediately appears.

We have been working on the option and ask you to agree on a three percent VAT deductible. And, most interestingly, we propose to divide it into two parts: two percent to the federal budget, and one percent to the municipal budget.

In the government of the Moscow region, we held a meeting on the results of covid, and they say: "You know, we kind of need you, but you're not very interesting, we don't get anything from you." This one percent of the municipality may also encourage the interest of local authorities and help companies consolidate and develop on a large business scale. Because American fast food companies, of course, captured the whole world and felt great in Russia. We need our own national champions.

Why am I performing? Because we have five of them today, and there should be dozens. And, unfortunately, this barrier often forces companies to split up, does not allow them to open in the regions, increase or scale their business.

The proposal to introduce a three percent VAT and continue to work out the issue of some kind of smoothing the growth of these social taxes, because this industry is also quite man-intensive, and the growth is strong. 3 percent is our main offer.

Vladimir Putin: And now?

Mikhail Goncharov: Now we have a 20% VAT rate, but it is deductible, and it is difficult to administer. People have huge problems there, and there are constant disputes: both the tax and law enforcement agencies constantly catch this VAT. This revolving tax is a very good idea. Now, in general, companies pay from 3 to 4 percent. That is, in principle, this is not a very serious decline, but it will allow the company to consolidate and develop.

Vladimir Putin: You know, Mikhail Petrovich, it seems to me that you are right, we are constantly discussing in the Government: we need to keep VAT or just change everything completely, switch to the turnover tax as a whole, and so on, that individual exceptions are ineffective. But it seems to me that just such a delicate work is being done by industry, while in Moscow this experiment is mainly carried out, right?

Mikhail Goncharov: No, it was all over the country.

Vladimir Putin: It started in Moscow, and I think it worked effectively.

Mikhail Goncharov: We started, yes. In Moscow, the main companies are Russian.

Vladimir Putin: Yes, of course. And in general, I think that what you say is appropriate. This will give us a big return, even at all levels of the budget system. You said that the Ministry of Finance conducted an analysis and generally believes that it is appropriate. And now we will see if this is the case. Let's ask Anton Germanovich whether the Ministry of Finance will support Mikhail Petrovich's proposal.

Alexander Siluanov: Mr President, good afternoon!

Indeed, we are with our colleagues, with catering entrepreneurs…

Vladimir Putin: Smiling is a good sign. He'll agree now.

A. Siluanov: Not with everything. We met with fellow entrepreneurs from the catering industry and, I thought, agreed on some good, positive steps.

First. We have agreed to raise the threshold from two billion rubles of revenue to three billion rubles, up to which VAT is not paid. We have agreed, and such amendments have already been prepared for submission to the Duma. The bill is currently under consideration for the second reading; we will introduce it and pass it in the spring session. This is already a good result.

Now what my colleagues say. Our colleagues say: let's make the VAT rate for public catering reduced, we said 3 percent here, so that there is no fragmentation and there is no desire to split up, but there are such facts, and we see that whole large public catering chains are being split up. We are also ready to consider the issue of 3 percent without deduction, maybe 3-4 percent. We still need to make more careful calculations here, and we are ready to work out such proposals together with our colleagues who work in public catering.

As for the transfer of part of the VAT to the regional and local level, we still ask not to change the general approaches. VAT is a federal tax, and we are taking a tougher stance on changing its focus.

As for insurance premiums, my colleagues also raised [the issue], it seems to me that this is a question of forming pension rights, and in general, the formation of resources that are needed for the health insurance system, pension insurance. By the way, decisions have already been made on a 15% rate for those categories of enterprises that have revenues of up to 2 billion rubles. There will also be up to 3 billion rubles, that is, there are already corresponding exemptions. Therefore, in terms of VAT, we are ready to work out, and I think we will find a solution.

But, Mr President, what did I want to say? Indeed, we believe that the experiment is successful. But I wanted to contact my colleagues, I know for myself: on Friday you come to a cafe or restaurant, they say: only for cash. Or they punch receipts, bring them through the terminal, but not invoices for the ordered service or for the ordered corresponding products.

Therefore, the experiment seems to be a success, but colleagues still continue to cheat. And here we all need to work together to ensure that we all comply with our common legislation, including tax legislation. Thank you.

Vladimir Putin: Yes, everyone is cunning, you just have to admit it, this is the law. For example, you just said: "We have submitted a law to the State Duma. Then you say, " We'll accept." But it is not you who accept it, it is the parliament that accepts it. Then: "And that's a good thing." And this is evaluated by the consumer, whether it is good or not. Everyone is cunning. We just need to find the best option to ensure that the consumer benefits, and that the state not only does not suffer, but the industry develops.

Mikhail Petrovich said about some administrative difficulties that arise when implementing what works. In general, it works well, Anton Germanovich [Siluanov] is right. What are the administrative difficulties that arise?

Mikhail Goncharov: First of all, calculating this 20 percent VAT is a very difficult task, accounting for invoices. And this 3 percent revolving tax is very easy to administer, we just won't spend it.…

Vladimir Putin: OK, I get it. But how do you get away from what the Finance Minister said – these bills and so on?

Mikhail Goncharov: Unfortunately, I think we should take tough measures. My suggestion is about big business, there is no such thing, these are serious big companies.

Vladimir Putin: What are the tough measures?

M. Goncharov: Legal.

Vladimir Putin: From 10 to 15? What? What are the tough measures?

Mikhail Goncharov: If the receipts don't get through, I just don't know what happens.

Vladimir Putin: All right, all right. Then, Anton Germanovich, I have a request and a suggestion for you. You should consult with your colleagues from the Ministry of Economic Development and suggest toughening measures so that, of course, they won't send anyone to prison for 20-25 years, but they will be effective and efficient. First.

And the second thing is that ... well, I can't disagree with Anton Germanovich, by the way, that splitting VAT, which is federal, and violating general principles, is not very good.

But what is important from what Mikhail Petrovich said is that the local authorities say that we are not very interested in you, because we do not receive anything from you. His idea is correct: you need to interest the local authorities somehow. One percentile or less, but they must have some income from this. And then they will actively contribute to the whole process. Anton Germanovich, we need to think about this.

Alexander Siluanov: I see, Mr President.

There, the only thing--I will immediately respond, if possible--is that this whole experiment is aimed at whitewashing this business. And as we whitewash-–and we see that this is indeed happening–-income taxes are being paid more and more. The salary increases because the salary paid is not lower than the average for the economy of the subject, and the subject receives its personal income tax. This is also a good help.

Vladimir Putin: These are indirect consequences–-positive, but indirect. But Mikhail Petrovich spoke of a direct interest–-we need to think about this.

I don't want to start a discussion here right now. But if you think about it, you can definitely find something that will interest local authorities in supporting this process, this business.

Take a look, please. Ok?

A. Siluanov: It's clear.

Mikhail Goncharov: Mr President, my mother and I would also like to take this opportunity to invite you to Teremok. She is the author of all Teremka recipes. If there is a chance, we will be very happy.

Vladimir Putin: Thank you very much. Without any jokes, without any irony, I want to thank you and with pleasure, indeed, when the opportunity comes–-I hope it will arise--I will definitely come to you. And there, you look, and Pavel Borisovich is not greedy. (Laughter.)

Pavel Titov: We already have a tandem.

Vladimir Putin: Thank you very much.

Alexey Repik: Thank you very much, Mr President.

We have completely different companies in Delovaya Rossiya. Now we are moving to high tech. Alexey Alexandrovich Kalinin, Aquarius, makes the base stations that we use to communicate in cellular communications and big data storage systems. Very serious, interesting and important work.

It seems to me that such companies are the first, as they say, in the queue to enter the public markets. And Elvira Sakhipzadovna [Nabiullina] very correctly says all the time that we need to replace debt capital, debt financing with equity.

Vladimir Putin: We need to attract citizens ' money.

A. Repik: Yes. In order to do this, probably, more effectively, again, fulfilling your instructions to increase the capitalization of the Russian stock market, which has a very ambitious goal and task, certain measures are needed.

I'll ask Alexey Alexandrovich then.

Vladimir Putin: Please.

Alexander Kalinin: Dear Vladimir Vladimirovich,

Let me personally congratulate you on the Great Victory Day.

Vladimir Putin: Thank you very much.

Alexander Kalinin: Mr President, thanks to your instructions and the Government's decisions, computer technology and other high-tech industries have grown significantly over the past three years and have accelerated at an accelerated pace. Technology is an integral part of our country's sovereignty and security, and it is our future.

To date, we have learned how to make cool products, such as, for example, servers that adequately compete with their Western and Eastern counterparts, and entire segments of data storage systems. Here the task is to create top-level systems, but I am sure that in the next year and a half we will cope with this, we will understand how to do it.

Finally, as Alexey Yevgenyevich said, we have already put into production the first Russian 4G and 5G base stations, which are already operated in the network of one of our largest telecom operators. I would like to take this opportunity to invite you to our production site; it will be a great honor if you can visit.

Vladimir Putin: Thank you. It's not pancakes, of course, but still.

Alexander Kalinin: But it's very interesting. This is really very interesting and worthy. And I think that what we and our competitors have done over the past three years is really a huge breakthrough.

Vladimir Putin: Thank you very much.

Alexander Kalinin: Base stations are already a ready-to-export product, and we are negotiating with friendly countries about this. For example, with Myanmar, and here, too, we count on your support–-I know that the head of Myanmar was at the Victory Parade. In conditions of very expensive money, it is extremely important for us today to maintain the same investment pace and potential of high-tech companies.

Vladimir Vladimirovich, as Alexey Yevgenyevich has already said, you have set a very ambitious goal to increase the capitalization of the stock market. This requires attracting new issuers, new investors, and fast and flexible financial resources. Technology companies already need and are ready to raise equity capital.

For many small technology companies, launching an IPO is an extremely expensive procedure: the costs of lawyers, reporting, and commissions to host banks amount to about five to nine percent of the placement amount, which is very expensive. However, IPO compensation is currently provided only for small technology companies that must be included in the special register of the MTC.

At the same time, an IPO is more relevant not for small companies, but for larger ones, and certainly for fast-growing companies. At the same time, a large company will most likely not use the compensation if its amount is small. That is, the amount of compensation itself may be a limiting criterion.

Vladimir Vladimirovich, we have three proposals.

The first is to expand and transform the MTK register into a register of high-tech companies that correspond to the taxonomy of technological sovereignty. Separately allocate the MTK segment in this register for targeted grant provision and extend the measures provided for in the federal project "Technologies" of the national project "Effective and Competitive Economy" to companies of the extended register to encourage IPO entry.

Second suggestion. We propose to create incentives in the form of personal income tax benefits for the purchase and ownership of public shares in the initial acquisition, i.e. IPO or SPO. This will provide significant appeal to retail investors and create healthy competition between stocks and deposits.

And the third. The taxonomy of technological sovereignty projects is an effective mechanism that has provided high-tech loans. In order to fill the high-tech market faster with money from professional investors, please instruct the Bank of Russia to consider various tools to encourage professional investors. For example, the ability to reduce reserve requirements for banks when investing in shares within the taxonomy.

Thank you very much. Thank you for your attention.

Vladimir Putin: I will start with what you have just finished. Incentives, of course, are correct, taxonomy is correct, and reducing the Central Bank's reserve requirements for commercial banks is all the more subtle.

After all, why does the Bank of Russia do this? This is one of the ways to fight inflation, these are obvious things. At the same time, the regulator, however, makes certain exceptions. But we need to talk to the Central Bank separately on this issue. Maybe this will pass in the discussions of the Central Bank – why? Because I don't think that the volumes there are very large, this is very important. And the direction, absolutely the key direction, is technological development, technological sovereignty. These are obvious things.

So, of course, I will talk to Elvira Sakhipzadovna. We don't have anyone in touch from the bank today?

E. Nabiullina: I'm here.

Vladimir Putin: Elvira Sakhipzadovna, I'll give you the floor now. See, he's also smiling, so everything is fine.

Everyone is smiling, everyone is in a good mood.

Now for the other two suggestions. Of course, we have an extremely important task to attract money from investors, including ordinary citizens, to these processes. That is why we have created conditions and increased insurance guarantees for citizens, which is good.

I think we have quite ambitious goals to increase our stock market, both primary and secondary investments, and so on. I think that's more than 24 percent of our GDP right now. And by 2030 or 2036--I don't remember which one–-we plan to achieve 66 percent of GDP. In other words, these are serious, very big tasks.

Before Elvira Sakhipzadovna takes the floor, I would like to give the floor to Maxim Stanislavovich Oreshkin, because he is also constantly engaged in this through the Administration. Now I give him my word on purpose, so that you will have support. Elvira Sakhipzadovna got bored right away. (Laughter.)

Maxim Stanislavovich, please.

Mikhail Oreshkin: Thank you very much, Mr Putin.

Here, of course, the main task is to stimulate exactly the moment when companies enter the stock exchange. We are not talking about buying and selling shares on the secondary market. This is an important story of stimulating the parish specifically for primary placement, and the issue of taxation of those incomes that appear here.

My colleagues and I have discussed this issue, and I believe that we can move towards our colleagues to a certain extent, because, indeed, then we will see more demand in the primary market. This means that there will be more initial placements, and not only will the goals be met the goals are not just calculated, they are taken from what we want to achieve. And we want to make sure that there is less debt capital, Elvira Sakhipzadovna keeps repeating. And that is why this movement is about creating conditions for such investments to be made.

And by reservation. The Ministry of Economic Development and the Central Bank have also done a lot of work here. This is a special register, in fact, a list of companies of technological sovereignty–-they have a special approach to lending. This measure is actually very effective, it is starting to work, it was recently launched a year or a year and a half ago, and it is starting to work. We need to look at how to adjust it, how to expand it.

I think Elvira Sakhipzadovna will tell you about it now.

Vladimir Putin: Thank you very much.

Alexey Alexandrovich [Kalinin], I must say that your suggestions, especially in the final period, are not original – please don't be angry. I will say why: because I have already heard many times from representatives of various fields of activity proposals of this nature.

Elvira Sakhipzadovna won't let me lie; I work it out every time in the sense that we discuss these issues with the chairman of the Central Bank. I can assure you that this is always the case, and Elvira will confirm it in a moment. But in general, I would like to ask you, Elvira Sakhipzadovna, to comment on this issue, how the Central Bank treats it. I can imagine how you feel about the third part, but in general.

You are welcome.

E. Nabiullina: Thank you very much.

In general, we support and try to create conditions for financing, first of all, projects of technological sovereignty and such structural adaptation. We understand that financial resources should be used for such projects.

We need banking regulation and regulations first of all to support the overall stability of the financial system. Why is it important? I also want to remind entrepreneurs that when we faced these difficulties in 2022, it was the stability of the banking system that allowed us to continue lending, restructure loans, and so on at a difficult time.

Therefore, of course, the banking system needs stable capital, so we are always so careful about this. But nevertheless, together with the Government, we have developed a good mechanism, and Alexey Alexandrovich said about it–-this is support for taxonomy projects.

In other words, the Government has developed criteria for a project that relates to technological sovereignty, and we have relaxed banking regulation based on these criteria. The register is maintained by VEB, and now there are 48 projects worth 3.5 trillion in the project register, and banks have already allocated a line for one and a half trillion and issued 500 billion for them – under light regulation. This tool was slow at first, but now we see that it is being used more actively.

What do your colleagues suggest? They suggest that this should not only work through banks, but also, for example, we would encourage non-state pension funds to invest in such shares, shares of technology companies. But here I must say that the regulation of non-state pension funds is probably even more stringent than in relation to banks, because it is the safety of future pensioners' money.

And of course, there should be some risk management involved. Therefore, our regulation now allows pension reserves to be invested in any shares within a special limit of seven percent. And, I must say, non-state pension funds do not choose this limit.

This is not a question of regulatory restrictions, because the limit is small, but it is often difficult for non-state pension funds themselves to evaluate such shares, especially if they are not traded. If they are traded on an exchange, it is much easier. By the way, we have allowed–-this was not the case before--and relaxed the requirements for participation of non-state pension funds in IPOs. That is, even when the initial public offering is underway, when the prices for these shares have not yet settled, but nevertheless they have done it.

This year, we plan to increase the limit on assets with a high level of risk and expand opportunities to buy shares not from the Moscow Exchange index. In other words, we are ready to move, but carefully, understanding that there should be management here, which is connected with the money of future pensioners. Therefore, we are ready to discuss this further.

Colleagues also raised the topic of supporting technology companies in general, and launching them on the stock exchange—Maxim Stanislavovich said this. We strongly support this. We do have cost-recovery measures, and for small companies, even for some medium-sized ones, entering the stock exchange is not the cheapest option. We support, in principle, the possibility of expanding the list of such technology companies.

But here the Government plays the first fiddle, because it determines these criteria by decree. We, as the Central Bank, have sent our proposals to the Government and hope that we will somehow complete this long discussion on these criteria, what companies can be, and will be able to extend the benefits that already work for small technology companies to a wider circle.

We also offered our own support measures not only for personal income tax, but also, I will say, for income tax in order to encourage companies to enter the market, because, indeed, we need to develop the capitalization of the stock market.

In the first speech, Pavel Borisovich [Titov], in my opinion, spoke about how important it is to reorient state support measures only from credit support to grants, when companies attract their own capital. We are also very supportive of this.

First, it is less inflationary. Because now, in order to get state support measures, you need to take out a loan. In order to develop, it is not necessary to take a loan: you can invest your own funds and offer them from the capital market.

Therefore, in our opinion, there should still be a set of measures that would encourage companies to enter the capital market. And it is very gratifying to hear that today not only in one speech, but in several, this topic is raised–-about measures to stimulate access to the capital market.

I'll stop here. Thank you.

Vladimir Putin: You know, both the first part and the second part are extremely important. What do I mean by that? First of all, the topic itself is a mainstream one. This is one of the most important areas – ensuring technological independence and growth, this is obvious. Second, and no less important, how to enter the exchange? Of course, the development of this tool itself is extremely important. We constantly talk about this with our colleagues from the Government and the Central Bank.

This is how I would like to conclude this part of our discussion: we certainly need to ensure the safety of pension funds--this is obvious. But here it is clear that these funds, our companies that hold money and rather big money of our pensioners, are sometimes difficult to understand.

First of all, I have a request to the Central Bank, the Government, and the Administration to help these funds sort it out. To develop some kind of tool that could give, first, to put it mildly, some advice. And the second and most important thing–-but it's difficult, of course, because now Anton Germanovich [Siluanov] will get nervous, but nevertheless--to support, to take on some part of the risk, that's what's important.

Of course, I understand that, especially in today's conditions, it is difficult to take on an additional burden on the budget, but such mechanisms can definitely be invented if you sit together. Take some of the risk yourself. This means that there must be some guarantees. We need to think together. I would ask the Central Bank, the Administration, and the Government to think about this issue together with you and with your participation.

Reply: Thank you very much.

Alexey Repik: Thank you very much. I really hope that we will be able to find some solutions that will suit Vysokotech.

And when we talk about technological sovereignty today, of course, it has completely different facets. The second one that comes to mind is our pharmaceutical industry. Vasily Gennadyevich (addressing V. Ignatiev), please speak.

Vladimir Ignatiev: Dear Vladimir Vladimirovich,

Over the past 10-15 years, most state support measures in the economy have focused on creating new industries, import substitution, and creating new jobs. However, at the moment when unemployment is at a historic low, and in a number of industries, including our pharmaceutical industry, a sufficient production base has already been created, the creation and development of new product lines is coming to the fore.

We believe that investing in new products can provide real technological sovereignty, open up access to international markets, and boost productivity growth.

Here is an example of our company. In 2014, under Government Decree No. 1044, we attracted a VEB loan worth 9.5 billion rubles at a subsidized rate. The investment was aimed at clinical trials of seven new medicines. Last year, we fulfilled all our loan obligations to VEB and closed them.

What happened in the end? The total investment amounted to 33.5 billion rubles, that is, the soft loan funds covered about a little less than 30 percent of the total need, the rest, the company's own funds. This just illustrates the situation that Pavel Borisovich [Titov] described at the very beginning, when his own funds did not go somewhere else, but worked synergistically with the subsidy provided.

Unfortunately, two of the seven drugs did not reach the market, and we had to stop working on them. We are still working on one thing at a time, and we are not losing hope. Four have been successfully registered and are already being sold, and two of them are protected by global patents and are in the process of registration or are already registered in 11 countries. And the number of such states is growing, including the countries of the Persian Gulf, Latin America, and the Asia-Pacific region. Their total turnover has already exceeded 40 billion rubles, and tax deductions--6.7 billion rubles, which is a multiple of the cost of subsidies. In other words, we got a situation that our English-speaking colleagues call "win-win": a double win.

What measures are working now? The most reliable and trouble–free mechanism is the Industrial Development Fund. Unfortunately, the amount of loans provided is insufficient to cover the costs of large research programs. Within the framework of the cluster investment platform, investor support is mainly focused on capital investments in construction, equipment of production facilities and development of already popular product lines.

We propose to refine the criteria of the rules for granting subsidies under Government Decree No. 295, in order to include the costs of creating new and improved products in the pharmaceutical industry, the so-called priority product lists.

As part of the "Pharma-2030" strategy, the Ministry of Industry and Trade is preparing a new profile program, which is directly related to the already mentioned compensations. The program will allow you to compensate up to half of the costs of clinical trials of new drugs if they are successfully registered. The program is good, we are very much looking forward to it, and we would like to speed up its adoption as much as possible.

For the most large-scale projects, there is a new tool from VEB.RF – - project finance factory. It was also mentioned earlier today. The factory is ideally suited for solving the tasks I mentioned, but there are no precedents for providing support in our industry for it yet. We believe that a certain industry priority is needed in the framework of the work of the "factory".

Finally, there are offsets at the regional level that involve the fulfillment of counter-obligations to investors and customers. The problem here is that these are long-term contracts, and the range of products delivered is fixed for ten or more years in advance, which makes it difficult to supply new and improved goods.

The issue of adjusting offset contracts in terms of the product range is not directly resolved by federal legislation. There is a mechanism of regional legal acts, but in the absence of a federal norm, it actually works extremely difficult. We ask that the Government be given the power to determine when and how offset contracts should be amended during the delivery phase to provide more flexibility to the customer and supplier in terms of delivering improved and newer products, of course, subject to the customer's consent and strict compliance with all investment obligations.

Vladimir Vladimirovich, you can be sure that our country is well protected in terms of accessibility and uncompromising quality of medicines, and with appropriate support, industry enterprises are ready to enter new markets and move forward. Thanks for attention.

Vladimir Putin: Vasily Gennadyevich, this is the most important area of work–-the health of citizens; it is one of the key topics, one of the key areas. And in recent years, of course, we have made huge strides forward here, just huge ones. I want to thank you and everyone who works in this field.

Of course, we know the same thing all over the world—there are more problems than solutions. It's in any country now poke your finger and we'll get into trouble. There is not a single country in the world, as it seems to me, where there are no problems in the field of medicine and pharmacy. But nevertheless, we have obvious progress, it is definitely perfect, but there is something to work on.

First, you know, I would like to comment on some things now. All right, let's have offset contracts. How old are they now, about 10 years old?

Vladimir Ignatiev: Yes, 10-11 years on average.

Vladimir Putin: And do you have a proposal to expand or increase it?

Vladimir Ignatiev: No, you should be able to change the product range without changing the deadline, because the range of popular pharmaceutical products is updated faster.

Vladimir Putin: That's it, I understand. Well, let's ask the Minister to comment right then, the Minister of Health.

Mikhail Albertovich (addressing M. Murashko), how do you feel about this proposal?

Mikhail Murashko : Good afternoon, dear Vladimir Vladimirovich!

Indeed, when forecasting for long periods of time, it is always considered that innovations in the healthcare sector can appear faster, so this proposal deserves attention.

Well, you can see that today the pharmaceutical industry is not only working for the domestic market, but also for export, which was said earlier. At their meetings with the heads of state, they noted that the Russian healthcare sector is interested in contacts with us, as well as the pharmaceutical industry. Therefore, we can definitely work in this area to make it more flexible and work out proposals together with the Ministry of Industry and Trade, since the Ministry of Industry and Trade is responsible for the contracts themselves.

Thank you.

Vladimir Putin: But, you know, it will depend on you in the end. In fact, the problem is not industrial, but medical in nature. Their offers are developing, and you need to register or facilitate registration.

By the way, does it happen, Vasily Gennadyevich, that you can't register here, but you do register something abroad?

Vladimir Ignatiev: No, we have never had such precedents. After all, we have priority in the home market and register here faster.

Vladimir Putin: You all laugh, but in fact, I can imagine what it means to register a medical product with us. This is a complex process, and many people complain about the administrative structures that do this.

Vladimir Ignatiev: We have no complaints here.

Vladimir Putin: If they had told him now, they would have appeared immediately, I understand. But I know that the processes here are not easy, so this is not an idle question.

As for the interaction between the two agencies, Anton Andreevich will now comment on it.

Minister of Industry and Trade of the Russian Federation: Thank you very much, dear Vladimir Vladimirovich. I will then try to reveal a few theses [speech] Mikhail Albertovich [Murashko].

First. In fact, we now have the opportunity to improve the quality of our products in accordance with the legislation, which was mentioned by Maxim G. [Reshetnikov], and the quality of our products is already possible by agreement of the parties.

But, of course, there are significant nuances, given the specifics of the pharmaceutical market. This is not an easy question, and the proposals that Vasily Gennadyevich [Ignatiev] mentioned, including additional clarifications in the Law 44-FZ "On Public Procurement", they probably won't hurt for greater legal certainty. In our opinion, this would be the right thing to do.

Specify the reasons for these renegotiations, for changing the properties of the delivered products. Indeed, we agree that article 111 of this law already authorizes the Government to make such decisions. But if the reasons are specified there, including in more detail, then, I think, this will make life easier for our entrepreneurs.

If I may, Mr President, I would like to comment on other aspects that Vasily Gennadyevich touched upon in his speech–-the so-called cluster investment platform. He said that not all expenses can be subsidized through this mechanism, which is administered through the Industrial Development Fund.

In general, we have now supported about 47 projects, and several dozen more are under consideration for an investment of about a trillion rubles. Indeed, we also support pharmaceutical projects. R-Pharm, in particular, combines an offset contract and support through the cluster investment platform of the Ministry of Industry and Trade. But here it was really justly said that a new mechanism for supporting innovative developments is needed, because the cluster investment platform focused on those drugs that are already, in fact, supplied and are included in these lists of vital drugs. And innovative, new developments need to be supported in some way in addition.

We are currently discussing this with our colleagues from both the business community and the Ministry of Health. Here, Mr Putin, the most important issue is the so-called right to make a mistake. We have three phases of clinical trials, all of which are quite extensive in terms of costs. At the Ministry of Industry, we are ready to subsidize a registered pharmaceutical product or drug based on the results of the third phase. Business asks us: no, let's also subsidize the first and second stages of clinical trials, because this is a significant burden for us, we need to develop so-called molecules.

Together with our business colleagues, Innopraktika has joined this process, and we are developing and reviewing international experience, such as Chinese. Over the past 7-10 years, they have become leaders in terms of the volume of accumulated molecules. That is, they have a reserve of these molecules—still unregistered pharmaceutical products, but the molecules that are patented are huge, it is now higher than even the leader of the traditional one--the United States. Now the Chinese have a higher potential.

We believe that we need to emulate this experience, just repeat it and land it on our soil. Therefore, we hope to coordinate all these approaches in the near future and report back to you with proposals that we hope to reflect in the budget in the next budget cycle and start helping our companies finance and subsidize these expenses.

Vladimir Putin: Here, of course, we need to coordinate the work of several agencies and the expert community. Tatiana Alekseevna, please.

Tatyana Golikova: Good afternoon, Vladimir Vladimirovich! Good afternoon, colleagues!

It is a very difficult question from the point of view of what Anton Andreevich has just said: subsidizing pre-clinics, and in some cases clinics. We have made a lot of serious progress in recent years. First, we have created preclinical databases. We have almost 119 preclinical bases, and we provide quite a wide range of opportunities for passing pre-clinical courses.

Now, as part of a new national project, part of the technological leadership project, new technologies for saving health, we are also creating clinical bases. And now, in the framework of 2025, if my memory serves me correctly, we are allocating 2.9 billion rubles to equip clinical bases in various areas of drug research. This is the first time we have done this on a system basis, but it is a definite help, including to our manufacturers.

There are also certain requirements for passing regulatory procedures in those countries where our colleagues are going to export their products. Each has its own regulatory requirements, which, in principle, we cannot spend the financial resources of the federal budget on. Here, of course, colleagues should spend money themselves. It seems to me that the solution here lies in finding a balance.

We, together with our pharmaceutical industry, together with the Ministry of Health and the Ministry of Industry and Trade, have developed a "road map" within the framework of the new national project "New Technologies for Saving Health"-–as we reported to you about it--which contains 186 international nonproprietary names of medicines that we must necessarily provide in the territory of the Russian Federation with our production in order to be protected from defects.

As a rule, state resources are spent on the purchase of these medicines--whether it is the federal budget or the budgets of the constituent entities of the Russian Federation. And this is a way to make money, including in the pharmaceutical industry.

And here, perhaps, we need to consider all the resources that the industry and the state have, from the point of view of allocating these resources for the purposes that we need: for preclinics, for clinics, and for the development of new medicines.

But, indeed, we are currently working with the Ministry of Industry and Trade in this direction. We very much hope that the measures we have taken, including in the framework of a new national project, will yield results and we will offer new solutions to support the development of new medicines.

Vladimir Putin: The formula that Mikhail Albertovich has just outlined, of course, sets up a good mood. He said I wrote it down: "Deserves attention for consideration."

Tatyana Golikova: Mr President, I may be a little more careful. The fact is that any offset contract implies essential conditions. And changing the essential conditions-this, in general, to put it mildly, does not really fit in with Federal Law No. 44, which regulates public procurement, and therefore subsequent competition, and so on.

Therefore, we need to carefully consider the circumstances that force us to change the essential terms of the contract. This is always a dispute between the antimonopoly authority and those bodies that protect the relevant industry.

I think that Mikhail Albertovich meant the following: that we are ready to look at the proposals of our colleagues, what kind of changing production conditions can be, which lead, I probably hope very much, to improving the quality of the products that were designated under the offset contract for a long period of time.

Once again, I want to finish where I started: I am cautious, because this is competition law and these are essential terms of the contract.

Vladimir Putin: Tatyana Alekseyevna, you mentioned Federal Law No. 44, but you and I are well aware that we have been floating around this issue for many years—it does not correspond to many things. We are constantly making some changes there, constantly doing this in relation to different branches of production.

You know, the main criterion is, of course, the interests of the consumer, this is an obvious thing. We must not make mistakes here–-I fully agree with you and Mikhail Albertovich, and I understand what is being said. But at the same time, this mechanism should be flexible. Of course, you need to ensure the interests of the consumer, because this is the health of people.

Business is a very important part of the whole process, but in the end, the main thing is people. This is something that people should try to do. Because if there is a more flexible approach, it means that people and consumers should get the product that is needed today in an improved form.

That's what we're talking about, isn't it, Vasily Gennadyevich?

Vladimir Ignatiev: Yes, of course.

Vladimir Putin: But we will also support businesses, help them respond more flexibly and, accordingly, have resources for future development.

I would ask both you and the relevant ministries–-both ministers have just spoken–-to regulate this issue accordingly and work on it. Okay?

Tatyana Golikova: All right.

Vladimir Putin: Thank you.

But I still have a question for Igor Ivanovich Shuvalov. Igor Ivanovich, how does this "Project Finance Factory" work in general under the bank's management?

Igor Shuvalov: Mr President, thank you.

Fabrika is working well: we currently have 39 projects in production for a total of almost six trillion rubles. We have projects in our portfolio that are currently being discussed, such as the pharmaceutical industry. However, there is no "Project Finance Factory".

What Anton Andreevich just said about the cluster investment platform, the factory, and other projects–-we are working on special tracks together with the Government, ministries and departments. So the fact that we don't have a pharmaceutical industry in Fabrika means that we use other tools to serve such projects.

By the way, I would like to say that we don't have a single problematic project in the Factory yet, Mr Putin. In general, this mechanism, which was proposed by Maxim Stanislavovich Oreshkin in 2017, has fully proven itself as the most reliable, but at the same time–-in the current conditions of a high key rate—it is very expensive.

This year alone, we will need about 300 billion rubles from the federal budget to subsidize 39 existing projects. Most of the funds are already provided for in the federal budget law. For the remaining funds, the necessary instructions were given at the level of the Government leadership. We expect that these funds will be fully provided to us and that we will fulfill all our obligations to our customers.

Here we have a very difficult job right now. On the one hand, the Ministry of Economic Development is the main promoter of the conclusion of new agreements on the "Project Finance Factory". The Ministry of Finance, of course, is quite conservative in its approach to this issue, so that we do not increase our federal budget obligations in the face of expectations of credit contraction and high interest rates.

Nevertheless, we review new projects and make decisions on new projects. Along with the fact that there is also the Industrial Development Fund, which is also part of the management of development institutions and the cluster investment platform, I think that we have no exception for the pharmaceutical industry in order not to provide such projects with credit resources in one way or another. The main thing is that we all have a consensus that such projects should be supported.

And of course, Mr Putin, thank you for your support. Despite the fact that we are always in disputes with the Ministry of Finance, I must say that the rehabilitation of VEB survived thanks to the serious support of Anton Siluanov. We've had a difficult situation for a long time. Just because Anton Germanovich took it upon himself, made the most difficult and hard decisions, we are so active in the market today, and we help the Government, and we carry out your instructions.

I hope that the Government is currently discussing the provision of additional capital to VEB, on the one hand, so that we can be prepared for lower rates and actively work in the market on the issue of project financing and other instruments. We are currently discussing what tools we can use to add to our capital.

On the other hand, we are currently discussing new directions as part of our new strategy. Now we operate in the old 26 priority areas, the pharmaceutical industry is included there. We are currently discussing with the Central Bank how to learn how to work in new mechanisms using the funds of pensioners, including those who are silent. Tomorrow Tatiana Alexeyevna has a corresponding meeting in the Government on the draft law–-we are preparing for it, and the Ministry of Finance will report there.

We now have the widest range of tools: from simple lending to lending with the support of the federal budget and involving other non-credit resources in order to direct them to replenish capital in certain projects. We are now here, if I may say so, among the best leaders, together with ministries and departments, and we cooperate with commercial banks.

We hope, Mr President, that in May, under the leadership of Maxim Oreshkin, we will provide a decision—already for your approval--on a new mechanism for coordinating development institutions within the framework of the National Projects Council. We are ready for this work, and this will help us make decisions faster.

Vladimir Putin: Thank you.

Alexey Repik: Mr President, you mentioned at the very beginning when you spoke about companies or industries that most of all do not want competition to return, such as agriculture, but in fact not only that. It seems to me that tourism is also doing well. But there is a combination of agriculture and tourism, which we have here today in the person of Roman Batalov, Chairman of the Board of Directors of Mantera.

It seems to me that, first of all, we all learned to travel around our country and discover new, completely interesting, unknown places in it. We have developed agrotourism, wine tourism, and industrial tourism. And I don't want to go to Turkey anymore, there are a lot of interesting options. And there is nothing to say about the success of our representatives in the agricultural sector at all. Here, indeed, sovereignty was achieved from the very beginning. So if you don't mind, we'll give you the floor.

R. Batalov: Good afternoon, dear Vladimir Vladimirovich! I would like to sincerely congratulate everyone on the Great Victory Day.

As Alexey Yevgenyevich has already introduced me, I represent the Mantera Group of companies–-as you initially said, absolutely one hundred percent domestic, our own brand. We manage more than ten thousand hotel rooms, have been creating a modern all-season tourist infrastructure for more than ten years, create and manage theme parks such as Sochi Park in Sochi, ski resorts, wine production and agricultural tourism. We are actively developing the amazing village of Mandrogi, which you also visited, and where we once again invite you with pleasure. The famous Vodka Museum still operates there. I think it will be just the thing with pancakes.

By the end of 2024, more than seven million people have already visited our resorts, and this number is growing by about 10-15 percent annually. We note that the interest in domestic tourism has almost doubled in recent years. Of course, all this becomes possible thanks to your support, the support of the Government of the Russian Federation.

We are also actively developing agrotourism, enabling our citizens who have recently been living in a fairly urbanized society to touch the origins, see how wheat grows, how it is harvested, how bread is produced, tell our children about it and give them the opportunity to understand that it does not immediately appear on the shelves. Also show how cheese is made on farms and, accordingly, get acquainted with local products.

In particular, in 2024, interest in farm recreation increased by 70 percent, and visits to wineries increased by more than 40 percent. We also have our own winery, which is visited by more than 40 thousand people a year, and our guests often express a desire to stay on this farm, spend the night, have breakfast in the morning in the vineyards, respectively, watch and participate in the grape harvest as well.

Unfortunately, we cannot give them this opportunity, as the land legislation contains a large number of mandatory prohibitive norms that do not allow them to adapt to the needs of business consumers. So we can't even build restaurants or guest houses there.

We would like to propose to discuss and work out the issue of comprehensive amendments to the land legislation, the transition to regulation using dispositive structures and norms that will directly allow the construction of wine and rural tourism facilities on agricultural land. At the same time, what is very important, I want to note by limiting the area occupied by such buildings, and the area of the buildings themselves.

To be honest, this is not the first time this issue has been raised. A similar issue was discussed in Stavropol during your visit in March 2024, but, unfortunately, it is not being resolved quickly yet.

We propose working together with the Government of the Russian Federation and the deputies to develop a formula in which farmers will be able to create a hospitality infrastructure on their land as a non-core activity, but at the same time the path for abuse will be closed. The balance of agricultural land will also be maintained and the possibilities for its use will be expanded.

Mr Putin, we also started our agricultural business more than 30 years ago. We have a fairly large division and an ecosystem that unites both the agricultural business and tourism. And we, like no one else, are aware of the priority of preserving agricultural land, because land is our value and, as you always say, it is the basis of food sovereignty.

We also propose to revise the prohibitive norms in the land and related legislation, which currently hinder development, as you said at the very beginning, and remove these barriers, the removal of which would give an impetus to the development of entire sectors of the economy.

Dear Vladimir Vladimirovich,

We do not ask for money, we ask you to support this initiative, we will try to do the rest ourselves. Thank you.

Vladimir Putin: Please tell me, what are the prohibitive norms that you are talking about revising?

R. Batalov: We have also discussed it with our colleagues, and today we are saying in particular: one prohibitive rule is that we cannot build on agricultural land.

Vladimir Putin: I heard that, yes.

R. Batalov: And there are a lot of such problems, because in agriculture, for example, we cannot build an elevator on this land, roughly speaking, we cannot build a processing process there. We have to look for land somewhere nearby that has already been transferred to a different category of land. But if we want to, it takes years to complete and is almost impossible.

Vladimir Putin: I understood. I will now give the floor to Oksana Nikolaevna Lut, and then I will also express my opinion on this issue. Oksana Nikolaevna, please.

O. Luth: Thank you very much.

Dear Vladimir Vladimirovich, Dear colleagues!

Indeed, I will confirm the words of Roman Alexandrovich, our agrotourism has been actively developing in recent years and is in demand among our citizens. Everyone is very interested to go, see how people are engaged in agriculture, and take part in it.

We really have a request from the business for a certain number of years on agrotourism and placement of accommodation objects on agricultural land and farmland. This question is complicated. We have allowed it by law, we have adopted amendments to the law, it is allowed to place farm houses on agricultural land, that is, for farmers to live, for people who are engaged in agriculture, with the accommodation of a certain number of guests.

The next topic is the guest houses themselves, in order to receive tourists on their farm, so that they can spend the night, stay. And here, given that we have a fairly large area of land and, in fact, land is our main means of production, of course, we are more sympathetic, probably, to the direction of faster land transfer. That is, not allowing construction, for example, on farmland, what Roman Alexandrovich said, we can't really build an elevator on farmland. It is necessary to grow products on farmland.

But at the same time, grain elevators can be built on agricultural land and land transfer is not necessary for this purpose. But nevertheless, it seems to us that the priority area for us is to make a faster translation. And indeed, now the transfer of land takes a long time, two or three years can take, based on all the plans of planning projects.

In April of this year, at the government commission on tourism, Dmitry Nikolaevich Chernyshenko considered this issue, and we were supported with the accelerated transfer of land from agricultural land, for example, to recreation. That is, for tourist services. This, according to our estimates, can reduce the transfer time to six months. In our opinion, this is a rather serious acceleration of the process.

And here we will continue on this path in any case. This is what concerns exactly agrotourism.

A separate area is, of course, enotourism. What is the special feature there? We have very little land suitable for growing grapes. Here Roman Alexandrovich talked about being able to build objects on suitable land. We have only 110 thousand hectares of them, but there may be a potential of 20-30 thousand more, which we can put back into the grape market.

That is, we have a shortage of such land, we have very little of it. And here, of course, we considered the possibility–-indeed, we had several conversations with our wine-growing community--of establishing very strict criteria in order to be able to place on such lands either the wineries themselves or places for tourists to stay.

The draft law is currently in the State Duma, but nevertheless we can go–-that is, we will continue to work in this direction. In our opinion, I will repeat once again, there should be very strict criteria so that there is no guile or this trick that you spoke about today. I would hate to lose probably one of our most valuable lands.

But, nevertheless, we can go along the second path, which I mentioned, within the framework of the entire agricultural land, that is, we can go along the accelerated version of the transfer. Here we will look at what we lose, what we gain, and make decisions. We will try to do it quickly. There are two ways to go, but, of course, for us, the classical priority is faster translation.

Thank you.

Vladimir Putin: I understand that for Roman Alexandrovich, as well as those who are engaged in this type of activity, it basically does not matter which way to go. The main thing is to achieve results. Or a quick transfer from agricultural land to land for settlements or recreation, or a construction permit on agricultural land. The main thing is that the result is there, so that they can work there.

As for the wine-growing lands…

O. Lut: Vinogradoprigodnykh.

Vladimir Putin: Grapes are very suitable. I can't even comment here yet, because I don't really understand how much of this land is really there. Probably, it is of particular value to us, because we are still a northern country, and there are not so many regions where you can engage in winemaking, if you look at how much land there is in total. Therefore, please discuss this issue with the Ministry.

But if the Ministry of Agriculture believes that it is better to save agricultural land–-we are now talking about this, about agricultural land–-to transfer it from one category to another, than simply allow the construction of recreational facilities on agricultural land itself.

Okay, let's do this, but just help make it real, so that it's a real contribution, not a conversation from year to year. What is Roman Alexandrovich talking about? It takes a very long time.

How long will it take, Oksana Nikolaevna, to resolve this issue? I mean, there is already something in the Duma.

Oleg Lut: It is precisely along the path of land transfer that I hope that with the support of parliamentarians, who will certainly have to change the same legislation, we could do this in the autumn session and adopt it this year. We would also like this very much, because we need to develop enotourism, we need to develop agricultural tourism.

Vladimir Putin: We need to work with deputies, [representatives of] business, and the Government-–the people there are not stupid, they will understand. And there are also, relatively speaking, their own lobbyists: someone lobbies for agricultural land, someone lobbies for recreation. It is necessary to gather everyone and make such a "Solomon's decision", to find this golden mean.

Just let's agree, until the end of the year is normal, satisfied?

R. Batalov: With pleasure.

Vladimir Putin: Let's agree that we will finish this work by the end of the year.

R. Batalov: Can I make a small comment? That's why we talked about finding this formula. We had one of the ideas: relatively speaking, the enterprise is 100 hectares, we allocate only ten acres of them, and on this territory it can be inconveniences, it can be planting, and so on. That is, we are not talking about what Oksana Nikolaevna says, to destroy or uproot vineyards. This is our bread, I apologize, too, we are fighting for it on the contrary.

Vladimir Putin: I understand. Tkachev, a former minister, told me about this. He gave me the whole bald spot, called me repeatedly, I didn't want to talk about it, but Oksana Nikolaevna knows, I also talked to Dmitry Patrushev about this. But you are still in contact with the Government, with the Ministry, treat it carefully and talk about it. Ok?

As for the transfer of land, let's agree to close this issue by the end of the year.

Alexander Repik: There are different types of tourism, and, of course, if you look at it, St. Petersburg is probably the main magnet of our tourism. The head of our St. Petersburg regional office is here with us today, and all other regional offices are in direct contact with us.

In fact, you probably know better than I do that in 1990 the whole of St. Petersburg was included in the UNESCO protected Area, and therefore the work in St. Petersburg on the restoration of buildings, in general, on working with cultural heritage sites is very difficult. And now Dmitry is concerned about this issue.

Dmitry Panov: Dear Vladimir Vladimirovich,

As Alexey Yevgenyevich said, I represent the cultural capital of our country, and I head the corresponding sub-committee in Delovaya Rossiya for the preservation and adaptation of cultural heritage sites. Of course, this issue concerns me very seriously.

As you know, today, as part of your instructions, the Government of the country is developing a special program until 2045 for the restoration of cultural heritage sites. As part of it, at least a thousand cultural heritage sites should be restored by 2030. As you put it, they should get a second life.

For this purpose, a special program of concessional lending has already been created, which allows you to get financing for the restoration of cultural heritage sites at 7 percent, but only for 24 pilot projects that are located in eight regions of our country. We believe that cultural heritage in other regions of our country also deserves the opportunity to be admitted to this program, and we propose to extend it to all regions of our country.

At the same time, we propose to extend the functions of agency for the involvement of cultural heritage objects in economic turnover, which DOM.RF joint-stock company successfully engages in, to regional and even municipal objects. This is critical.

At the same time, the current mechanism for working with cultural heritage sites requires additional adjustment. The fact is that in some cases, the investment and recovery cycle reaches more than seven years for some objects. We believe that it is possible to significantly reduce these time costs if on the current most important resource for investors "Heritage.DOM. RF" will provide comprehensive information on the restrictions of different ranges that apply to cultural heritage sites, as well as on their investment attractiveness.

Dear Vladimir Vladimirovich,

We believe that these proposals can really contribute to the speedy restoration of the unique objects that are located in the regions of our country, as you have previously stressed, which will serve to strengthen our identity. And most importantly, they help attract even more private investors to this important process. We sincerely hope that you will support us in this. Thank you.

Vladimir Putin: I support you.

Dmitry Panov: Thank you.

Vladimir Putin: I speak without irony. In fact, many objects simply "die", and businesses cannot invest money, because there are certain restrictions. There are people who believe that business should not be allowed at all. And what if we allow the objects to be destroyed completely?

The program you mentioned is at 7 percent, right?

Dmitry Panov: From 7 percent.

Vladimir Putin: You know, your first proposal should be extended to all regions instead of eight–-this is due solely to budget restrictions. For all regions of Russia, this means that the number of objects will simply be increased and that's all. You just need to read this money.

Regarding the division into regional and municipal items-this is probably also true. Then, perhaps, decisions on this issue will be made more flexibly.

Who from the Government can comment on this? Maxim Gennadievich, can you say something about this?

Mikhail Reshetnikov: Yes, Mr President, DOM. RF is indeed currently selecting these projects. Currently, 24 projects have been selected, the rate is 7 percent, and they are pilot projects. Our colleagues want to expand it, but here we are really within the budget allocations. Therefore, I think we need to put together different programs here.

For example, we also support hotels in the framework of "Tourism", and on your instructions, we also changed the parameters and significantly reduced the number of rooms, because, as a rule, cultural heritage sites are significantly smaller. For example, in the last selection, several, in my opinion 17, objects were included in all these selections as a result. And hotels in cultural heritage sites are also being restored, just through other mechanisms.

Therefore, I think we need to put all this together in a single program and, above all, devote more effort to optimizing the construction cycle, the restoration cycle. Now the Ministry of Culture is doing a lot of regulatory work, and laws have been developed, and so on. Maxim Stanislavovich had all these solutions assembled and worked out. They are all known, and we are implementing them now. I think that together we will promote this.

And coming back to the topic of financial easing, I think maybe we need to make a more flexible mechanism there, because we have either 7 [percent], when the rate is 26 now, and when the rate goes lower, I think some mechanism needs to be made more flexible, and then we will be able to cover a larger volume. Just think about how to adjust it. Give us an assignment, let's finish it.

But it is a fact that the demand for this program is very high. And the fact that there are big effects when these objects are involved in economic turnover, it will be so. We need to continue doing this.

Vladimir Putin: It is very good that the demand is high. Because when we proposed this program, discussed it, just said that there would be no interest at all. We need to invest money, such restrictions, GEOP [state unified cloud platform] it works there, a lot of its own requirements, and then all this turns into the fact that the object is not very suitable for commercial purposes.

Nevertheless, people go and invest. We need to de-bureaucratize this issue as much as possible. Please work it out.

Marat Shakirzyanovich, in the framework of " DOM.RF " are there any innovations that can be successfully used?

Mikhail Khusnullin: Mr President, we started working on this topic recently, on cultural heritage sites, so we will definitely support this idea. This is especially true for housing construction, as many of our cultural heritage buildings are now inhabited by residents. And thank you, by the way–-the Ministry of Culture and I have passed a law that allows us to renovate the housing stock there.

I would fully support Maxim Gennadyevich. Of course, we need to take a very serious look at the cost of restoration work, the cost and timing, because today they are increased from 30 to 200 percent compared to normal construction work.

I have already given this order to the Ministry of Construction. Together with the Ministry of Culture, we would look at security items and how much it costs to restore them. Then we will definitely be able to completely reduce the cost and speed up the restoration of these objects. There are a large number of them, and we are now actively working with the governors to identify such objects in the whole country. We have already identified thousands of unused objects that are in demand for businesses. We believe that this will be of great benefit to the regions and businesses. Thank you.

Vladimir Putin: Marat Shakirzyanovich, what could be the result of completing this work?

M. Khusnullin: The result, Mr Putin, is that instead of unused or poorly used objects, we will have normal cultural heritage sites. This is important for tourism, for the appearance of cities, and for landscaping. That is, for all the advantages of this.

Vladimir Putin: Marat Shakirzyanovich, I understand that. It is clear why to do this. What decisions should be made so that this work can proceed in a different direction, which my colleague just mentioned?

M. Khusnullin: First of all. We need to work out the cost and issue appropriate standards for reconstruction. Together with the Ministry of Culture, we must issue the relevant regulations. This is one thing.

The second is to reduce the investment and construction cycle. We have reported to you many times, and we are working very actively with Delovaya Rossiya here, with Alexey [Repik]. Let's see how much it will be possible to reduce the time of restoration. One of my colleagues said that up to seven years. In general, Vladimir Vladimirovich, you have set us the task that no more than three years from the idea to the completion of construction of any object, except for unique and complex ones. This is the target task that should be set-so that no more than three years from the idea to registration. This is our goal.

Vladimir Putin: Good. And when do you think, in what time frame you could work together with your colleagues and put the necessary end to it?

Mikhail Khusnullin: I think that we will adopt the necessary regulations together with the Ministry of Culture by the end of the year.

Vladimir Putin: Good.

Tatyana Golikova: May I ask your permission, Mr President? I just can't [keep silent], because I gave instructions on this matter. Please excuse me.

Vladimir Putin: Tatyana Alekseyevna, you were ahead of me. I just wanted to say that we have Tatyana Alekseevna…

Tatyana Golikova: I'm sorry to interrupt.

Vladimir Putin: No, no, I'm listening carefully. You are welcome.

Tatyana Golikova: My colleague has already mentioned this small program for 24 objects, and the main problem of its expansion is, of course, subsidizing the interest rate. About these 24 objects, it is clear that there is a rate of 7 percent.

Ministry of Culture, "DOM." In today's conditions, they offer a rate of 9 percent, but for other objects—what we considered at the meeting separately with the Prime Minister is still 17 percent. Of course, this is a huge bet, this is understandable. But even here you can understand the Ministry of Finance.

Therefore, in accordance with your instructions, the Ministry of Culture, together with other colleagues, has prepared a program until 2045 to put the relevant cultural heritage sites in order (although it is still being approved). Until 2030, this program includes a thousand objects. We are currently coordinating financial parameters.

What Marat Shakirzyanovich says, he is absolutely right here, the standards of restoration work there require revision. Now, by May 15 of this year, that is, within a few days, the Ministry of Culture together with the Ministry of Construction should submit a roadmap for revising the relevant restoration standards so that we can complete this work in 2026. It is not easy, it is complex, but the revision of regulations will really shorten the investment cycle.

In addition, the Parliament is currently working with us on four draft laws. They are different – both governmental and parliamentary. They are aimed at reducing unnecessary administrative procedures in order to shorten the investment cycle. Some of them were adopted in the first reading in December 2024, and some of them were adopted in the first reading in March 2025.

We hope that these laws will now be finalized for adoption. This will already lead to a reduction in terms of time, because separate administrative procedures will be removed. Plus the revision of the relevant standards, which Marat Shakirzyanovich just spoke about and on which we are just now coordinating the "road map". And of course, the adoption of the program I mentioned and the coordination of certain financial parameters with the Ministry of Finance.

We currently have 13,975 monuments of various purposes in unsatisfactory condition, and our efforts are focused on them, in short.

Vladimir Putin: Tatyana Alekseyevna and Marat Shakirzyanovich, of course, we need to have long-term planning on any issue, and on this one as well. We need to understand where we are going, how fast we are going. Only in this case will we be able to plan in the medium term and build a longer-term one. And without this, it is difficult to work, otherwise there will be a mess just in the head and in the documents. Our plans for 2045 probably need to be done right, and that's exactly what it is.

But we understand that by 2045, either the donkey will die, or the emir will no longer control what happens in real life. Therefore, we still need to build what we see, what we can do, and what we can control now, based on our grandiose plans.

Therefore, if we agree that certain things must be adopted before the end of the year, standards for these works and so on, something else that will de-bureaucratize this complex process, but it is very important for the country, very important. These are all the objects of our material culture, they are what make up our identity, what we are really proud of, and what we can see with our own eyes, and our children will look at them.

So let's work together, please, until the end of this year. Let's work on the standards exactly, and on some other things that you just mentioned, exactly until the end of this year. What is impossible to do now, well, let's do it in 2026. But it is also necessary to plan everything.

I would ask Maxim Stanislavovich Oreshkin to note all this in the draft decisions accordingly. Ok?

Thank you very much.

Alexey Repik: One of the people who stayed in the Kremlin, Mikhail Lvovich, is the one we started with today. In fact, this is our "Ikea" – five million sofas and beds are made from "Hoffa" in our homes.

Vladimir Putin: We'll need them, your beds, after the pancakes and Abrau-Durso products.

M. Kuchment: Beds and mattresses. (Laughter.)

Vladimir Putin: Please.

Mikhail Kuchment: Dear Vladimir Vladimirovich,

I head the Delovaya Rossiya Retail Committee and am a co-founder of the Hoff company. This is the leading Russian retailer in the segment of furniture and household goods: today our products are available in every fifth house in the country.

I've been in the industry for 25 years. When we started our business, thanks to the open doors of our economy, foreign companies were already able to occupy the best niches, get preferences for development, and gain a foothold in the minds of consumers. We learned, adopted best practices and developed technologies, but most importantly, we were closer to our customers.

Thanks to this, we gained the trust of Russians and began to compete on equal terms. I say this with pride, because today Russian retail is not inferior in anything, and in many ways even surpasses foreign formats. I would like to take this opportunity to invite you personally to our hypermarkets to make sure that this is true.

The next big challenge was the high dependency on imports. That is why we developed our ecosystem of local producers, primarily small and medium-sized enterprises from small towns that grew together with us. As a result, today more than 90 percent of our turnover is made up of goods produced in Russia.

Then the pandemic came, and we lost 80 percent of our sales at one time, but thanks to the Government, we overcame these difficulties. Today we are facing a new challenge. The competitive field has changed: due to the opportunities of online platforms, entrepreneurs, including small manufacturing businesses, which should certainly be supported, have increased their activity and gained much wider access to consumers.

However, the same access was granted to unscrupulous companies that create a situation of tax arbitration. Being on preferential tax regimes, they do not pay VAT, applying business fragmentation practices, while previously they were limited only to non-network retail and markets.

Here I would like to thank the Government separately for the decision to introduce working VAT for entrepreneurs on the Simplified Tax system. This is the right step, which significantly limits the possibilities for tax schemes. But unfortunately, there is still a possibility of abuse in the trade.

Some market participants, taking advantage of the benefits, not only evade taxes, but also dump due to illegal importation of goods or outright counterfeit. It is obvious that such companies are not interested in either increasing productivity or digitalization.

Vladimir Vladimirovich, we are not talking about imbalances between offline and online sales channels. We are no longer traditional retail, but in fact, the same online companies that develop their own stores, which, of course, improve the overall customer experience. Rather, we are talking about additional tuning of the system itself, which preserves the possibility of various abuses by companies that use, among other things, a huge e-commerce resource.

Therefore, we ask you to instruct the Government to work out a further reduction in the threshold at which trading companies start paying turnover VAT and the gradual abolition of the USN regime in trade. At the same time, it is necessary to maintain preferential treatment for manufacturing companies, the service sector and non-chain stores, where these measures really work as growth points. We stand for equal conditions and payment of taxes by all market participants.

Thank you very much.

Vladimir Putin: You know, you've just said so yourself. Of course, e-commerce is a separate big business, this is understandable, and it is developing, and thank God. Why? Because people in small localities, anywhere, all over the country, and in large ones, too, often use these services, because it is faster, more efficient, and so on. And this needs to be supported, and we will do it, without any doubt.

If this is due to the fact–-and this is true, I agree with you, we observe it, and the customs registers, and other bodies, including fiscal ones--that these tools are used for" gray " imports, in fact, and those who actually do nothing enjoy benefits they don't produce it here, but only import some things there, and they don't pay the corresponding taxes. That is, there is nothing good here from the point of view of supporting a domestic manufacturer. These are obvious things.

I think the head of the Russian Tax Service is in touch with us. Yes, there is?

Dmitry Yegorov: Yes, Vladimir Vyacheslavovich.

Vladimir Putin: Daniil Vyacheslavovich, please comment.

Dmitry Yegorov: Good afternoon!

You know, you are absolutely right to say that we are seeing quite serious changes in the structure of the economy, including in sales models. I remember when we started the project with cash registers, we had mostly the largest players, it was offline retail. Now everything has completely changed.

And here, I think, the first thing that is important is that we took a very serious step that year. First. On the basis of your instructions to the Federal Assembly, we have drawn up norms that were supported by the legislators, and we have declared an amnesty for those who used the division. And at the same time, we made a smoother, so-called simplified tax regime. The total rate can now be applied from 250 to 450 million rubles of revenue.

And at the same time, as a colleague correctly said, we have introduced a value-added tax for those over 60 [million]. This is the stage at which we can actually observe how the competitive field will level out. If we see significant changes and distortions in the behavior of taxpayers up to 60 million rubles, then, of course, it will also be possible to make a decision there.

I would not be in a hurry to immediately agree with this. Why? Because, probably, it would not be entirely correct to base the entire tax policy solely on the behavior of bad [taxpayers]. Most of our taxpayers are definitely conscientious, and do not split up, and conduct a transparent, understandable business. These distortions, of course, exist, and we are working with them. This is the first part.

And the second one. As soon as we see and offer our colleagues from the Ministry of Finance, Anton Germanovich, the data on which we will base our tax forecasts, then, in fact, the Ministry of Finance will decide whether to move towards lowering the thresholds for value-added tax.

Thank you very much.

Vladimir Putin: You said that you should not make any sudden moves based only on the behavior of those who abuse the current conditions, and we are working with them. And how?

Dmitry Yegorov: So it's the first one. If we talk directly about those who work through online platforms, we are now in a state of experiment, where we exchange data with the main online platforms of the country, because our colleagues also have quite serious data on how their customers work when selling goods through them. Thus, we will be able to monitor these sales, and when identical products, identical IP addresses, there are many, many indicators, when they match, we will actually be able to influence these taxpayers--so carefully, in order not to eliminate them, but before they gain a large, conditionally, mass of sales, we adjusted and switched to the general tax system. This is the first one.

Second. As I have already said, there is now fragmentation, since our value-added tax is now from 60 million, and not as in the simplified tax system it was from 250 million, the motivation for fragmentation itself is no longer so pronounced. That is, now it will only need to be done in revenue of up to 60 million rubles. Naturally, it will be much easier for us to observe in this part than when it comes to companies with large volumes.

And the last one is probably also worth noting. Today we offer tax regimes, in particular, auto-USN, on the basis of which we do tax calculations for taxpayers. This is probably the line that is available today. This is what applies to taxes.

As for counterfeit goods, this is a separate issue, and it should probably be discussed separately. It's not really a tax issue.

Vladimir Putin: The fact is that counterfeit goods also take on complex forms. There is still a need to understand: here he [Hoff] makes these mattresses and beds, but he knows that it is he who makes them, and someone brings them in, makes them up. This is the same as in our wine industry: tankers brought wine materials and bottled them, conditionally, like Kuban wine. What kind of Kuban wine? What does this have to do with it? It's the same with beds, actually. We need to deal with this too. I take it that's the case?"

Mikhail Kuchment: Yes.

Vladimir Putin: So what you just said, Daniil Vyacheslavovich said, does that suit you? Or do you still insist on some more essential changes?

Mikhail Kuchment: I think we would like to see how the experiment is going on on online platforms, and really understand what results this can lead to. There are certainly tools available to identify such unscrupulous participants.

Vladimir Putin: I understand, yes. Therefore, I also have a request to the Administration. Maxim Stanislavovich [Oreshkin], when you are going to issue an order, be sure to fix this moment. So that it does not hang in the air, does not fly away anywhere, but that it is in the field of our attention: in the field of attention of the Government, the Tax Service, and, accordingly, with the participation of business itself.

Mikhail Kuchment: Yes. I hope that when the data is available, we can look at it together…

Vladimir Putin: Yes, that's how we need to organize all this work. Thank you.

We are completing our work. Before that, it would be possible and useful to have someone from the audience [speak]. Is there a microphone in there?

A. Repik: Of course.

Vladimir Putin: On our screen in the hall of the Situation Center, I see Sevastopol, Kabardino-Balkaria.…

A. Repik: All regions, all 89 subjects.

Vladimir Putin: We are unlikely to be able to hear all this today. Let's ask a couple of questions from the audience, then from the regions.

Alexey Repik: Then maybe we should start with the hall. Ekaterina Lobacheva was preparing for a very important issue for us. I'm talking about inclusion and support for disabled people.

Elena Lobacheva: Good afternoon!

Vladimir Putin: Good morning.

E. Lobacheva: Vladimir Vladimirovich, good afternoon! Thank you very much. It was very difficult to remain silent while we discussed trade, because I represent X5, the largest grocery chain in the country–-Pyaterochka, Perekrestok and Chizhik. We are one of the largest employers today. We employ more than 430,000 people. Therefore, the issue of involving people with disabilities in employment is very important for us.

We have long been aware that creating an inclusive environment both inside stores for our customers and on our infrastructure in general, as well as for our employees, is, in fact, our task. And since 2016, we have been engaged in inclusive employment in various specialties.

These include sales clerks, sales floor administrators, and store managers. Of course, IT office staff to a greater extent and, of course, management positions. And we can see how this affects the development of the company's internal culture. This increases the involvement of all colleagues, mutual assistance and complicity, and now this is very important.

And in practice, we see what difficulties both companies and candidates face when hiring and adapting. Although now we understand that we have a large personnel deficit and, Mr Putin, this is a huge talent pool for the whole country.

Currently, we have approximately 11 million disabled people, including more than four million disabled people of working age and eligible for inclusion. According to MSU estimates, if we could employ everyone, GDP per capita could be increased by 0.5 percentage points, but today we have employed no more than 27.5 percent. In fact, in practice, both companies experience quite high costs for employment and adaptation, and for the candidates themselves, sometimes there is a fear of socialization and there is a risk of losing their financial situation, because part of the regional payments for employment is stopped.

The State is already doing a lot to promote inclusive employment. And we ask you to support additional measures that we see in practice. First of all, we ask you to support free retraining and higher education in the profession that is currently in demand, regardless of the first education you received. And now there is a national project "Personnel", which also has retraining and retraining, and we ask you to include relevant specialties in trade.

Secondly, to develop the institution of social coordinators. This will help people choose this sought-after profession and then be accompanied during the first months of their employment. For them, this creates additional comfort.

We ask you to consider the possibility of preserving material security for people after employment, especially for those who have special merits for the Fatherland, so that again, they have psychological comfort and opportunities, and the desire to get involved in employment.

And the last one. It is still possible to consider reducing insurance payments only for the wages of employed disabled people. We're not talking about the company as a whole. At least for the first time, as part of a pilot project, this will allow companies to reduce their financial burden on their employment and adaptation and increase the motivation of businesses to employ disabled people.

Of course, I understand that now Anton Germanovich will say that this is a loss of income. But if this "pilot" shows its success, then, perhaps, as a result of its implementation, we will see increased numbers of employed disabled people and in absolute terms, the figures for paying insurance premiums will be higher.

And we--the X5 company and, in principle, trading companies--are ready to be participants in all experiments and scale all these practices in the future.

Thank you very much.

Vladimir Putin: Yes, you said correctly about the reduction of contributions to insurance funds, because the insurance funds are just contributions to solve social problems, so to speak. Although, probably, for a while it would be possible to save it.

As for getting a free second education, regardless of getting the first one. We have discussed this issue and it seems that we have even decided on it, and this issue was repeatedly discussed at meetings with the Government. The same applies to social coordinators and maintaining social support after employment. We have repeatedly discussed these issues at the Government level.

Tatyana Alekseevna, what condition is this in?

Tatyana Golikova: Vladimir Vladimirovich! Colleagues!

You remember quite correctly that everything related to education is provided for in Article 79 of the Law "On Education", and we have the right to receive an education. My colleague was right about the possibility of retraining.

In addition, our new national human resources project provides for subsidizing jobs for people with disabilities. If they are participants in a special military operation, these are virtually all disability groups that they have, and appropriate financial resources are provided for the adaptation of jobs, 200 thousand per workplace. We are currently implementing this procedure with the regions.

Now, as for the reduction of insurance premiums. You know that this kind of reduction should be compensated by the federal budget, as my colleague said correctly. But last year, a different decision was made regarding compensation. Today, these expenses are assigned to the Social Fund, and strictly speaking, this means that we should subsidize reduced tariffs with the same social expenses. In other words, this is, in fact, a hidden subsidy of trade.

But I'm starting from something else. We still have a socially responsible business. It turns out that the business is socially responsible, but if you need to hire people with disabilities, then the state should provide some benefits to socially responsible businesses.

Nevertheless, I believe that we have recently made a rather serious set of decisions, and from January 1, 2025, we launched new solutions in order to expand employment opportunities for people with disabilities. And now, in this sense, there is no need to make a decision on reducing, even temporarily, insurance premiums. Because let me remind you that in the system of compulsory social insurance, we still have a rule that the contributions paid by employers form the pension rights of citizens, including those people we want to get a job, who currently have health restrictions.

Therefore, I do not share the proposal of my colleagues regarding reducing insurance premiums, even in the pilot mode, today, because this is the source of forming pension rights. As for everything related to education, retraining, I repeat, everything related to subsidizing jobs and employment, we have all these measures in place, and we are implementing them.

Vladimir Putin: That is why I started with this and said that we have repeatedly discussed these issues with the Government, and decisions have been made. I just had a question. They may not be implemented in some way, but they are still being implemented, including with regard to obtaining a second education.

As for the expenses related to insurance and social funds, the issue is very subtle. Despite the fact that Tatyana Alekseevna questioned the social orientation of Russian business, I still think that in this discussion of such polemics, we see that our business, especially in recent years, is built both patriotically and socially meets the requirements of today.

But here, of course, we cannot allow any imbalances, because the budget is also socially oriented. We also use the budget of social funds to solve the main issues related to social security of citizens in the broadest sense of the word. So let's agree on this here. Still, it will be necessary to analyze what can be done additionally from what has already been done regarding the employment of people with disabilities.

Tatyana Alekseyevna knows this very well, and we have already talked about it a hundred times, perhaps even more: the employment of people with disabilities is a key moment for ensuring the normal life of these people, our citizens. Because when a person works, it radically changes their life, this is an obvious thing, this is one of the most important issues that we must address. From this point of view, let's now analyze the issues that were just raised by a colleague from the audience.

Thank you.

A. Repik: And maybe then it resonates with the words of Tatyana Alekseevna. We have Sergey Kolesnikov there, who does exactly the opposite–-he just wants to briefly focus on unpaid contributions from the self-employed and representatives of individual entrepreneurs.

Sergey Kolesnikov: Good afternoon, Mr President! Dear colleagues!

I would like to touch on the competition of companies for personnel, which is still lacking, and experts note that the shortage of personnel is from two to four million [people] in Russia.

As you know, the law on the self-employed has been in force since November 2018, and this law has allowed millions of citizens to come out of the shadows and pay taxes, and the state has received billions of rubles in tax revenues. Moreover, Russian citizens, in particular, probably every resident of large cities, began to receive high-quality, safe and cheap services, in particular, self-employed drivers through Yandex.Taxi service.

All this shows that the example is successful, but there is also a fly in the ointment. Companies began to attract self-employed labor instead of hired labor, and since there is tax arbitration, hired labor costs the company 43 percent (30 percent – social tax, 13 percent-personal income tax), while self-employed labor costs companies only six percent.

The self-employed, by the way, Vladimir Vladimirovich, do not pay social taxes and do not pay personal income tax. So when I see a young driver and a veteran of the SVO, of course, my heart belongs to Ekaterina [Lobacheva] here, because I see these pictures and it is clear that for some reason one category does not pay, and the other pays.

In this sense, there is still competition for personnel. It is clear that companies that pay 43 percent and companies that pay six percent are in unequal competition. Therefore, please: strengthen prevention and supervision of companies that use civil rights and attract self-employed individual entrepreneurs instead of hired labor.

Thank you very much.

Vladimir Putin: As you know, when we made a decision on self-employed and individual entrepreneurs, there were a lot of disputes. Will it work at all, will we be able to achieve the goal that we set for ourselves, namely, the goal of "whitewashing" this business, will people register, will they believe the steps that the state is taking?

In general, everything works out, yes. But, of course, the costs you mentioned were also probably unavoidable.

I would ask Reshetnikov, the Minister of Economic Development – [the Ministry of Economic Development] took an active part, of course, in this work, this is their field of activity – to comment.

Please, Maxim Gennadievich.

Mikhail Reshetnikov: Mr President, this is a difficult question. Indeed, we started with the legalization of the self-employed, and we have made a giant step forward here.

But what's going on right now? We have a very different level of tax burden when purchasing labor under different, let's say, tax schemes and tax regimes. That is, in our country, when labor is bought as labor, as labor relations, they pay personal income tax and then pay social contributions.

When we, for example, buy labor as self-employed, through the self-employed, through the civil law form, the rate is from four to six percent. At the same time, they can also buy labor from individual entrepreneurs–-we have quite a lot of individual entrepreneurs without employees. That is, in fact, these are the same civil-legal relations that are very difficult to separate from labor relations in some cases, and there may even be one percent.

That is why we are also holding discussions with the Ministry of Finance and the Tax Service. We have a common opinion that we still need to normalize this system somehow. At least so that legal entities, when they buy labor in various forms, still have these various distortions, let's say, less. Because when we introduced the self-employed, we still introduced them in terms of "physics to physicists". And when our legal entities start hiring self-employed people in large volumes, there are quite a lot of signs of transformation of labor relations.

What have we done now? We have now agreed with Rostrud and the Ministry of Labor on the criteria for inspections through Rostrud in order to identify those companies that actually, let's say, buy labor, but under the guise of these tax regimes. This is the first part. We are currently experimenting with these checks, and we have also discussed them with the business community. Let's look at the results for the first quarter.

And we still need to go out to unify tax regimes and, most likely, somehow carefully discourage legal entities that actually acquire labor under the guise of these different tax regimes. Why do I think we should do this now? Because our economy is labor-deficient.

And of course, this factor of manipulation, let's say, and optimization, the use of different tax regimes, and the reduction of labor taxation is, on the one hand, what causes Tatyana Alekseevna a lot of problems, because a fairly large amount of social contributions is simply underpaid. On the other hand, this is what really hinders the growth of labor productivity in the economy. Because if it is possible to use labor inefficiently at the expense of underpaying taxes, it is wrong, it reduces the overall efficiency of our economy.

Therefore, we understand how sensitive this topic is, and we will discuss options together with the business community, but we believe that the time is slowly coming up to resolve these issues. We will offer a solution.

Vladimir Putin: OK, and that's probably the right thing to do. But in no case should we take steps that would drive the self-employed back into the shadows. You need to be very careful here.

Anton Olegovich, can you add something?

Alexey Kotyakov: Dear Vladimir Vladimirovich,

Indeed, today we have developed eleven criteria that indicate that there may be a fact of substitution of labor relations with the tax regime of the self-employed.

Together with the Federal Tax Service, we analyzed the situation in such enterprises based on the information available in the Federal Tax Service. Today, we already have a certain list of enterprises that are being analyzed under the pilot regime, and we are holding consultations together with the Prosecutor General's Office and Rostrud.

Accordingly, we can already see that, taking into account the consultations that we hold with individual enterprises, our colleagues are paying attention, let's say, to the feasibility of switching to traditional labor relations–-namely, legalization and their transition to the standard for paying the full amount of tax deductions in the amount of 43 percent.

That is why we have started this work, and I hope that in this particular case it will allow us to correct these distortions that are currently present in the system of taxation of labor relations and will form a correct understanding on the part of business and the authorities regarding the regulation of this area.

Vladimir Putin: Good. Just please pay attention to the comments that I made. These steps should not drive anyone back into the "gray zone". Carefully.

Colleagues, I said that we have some regions–-pictures on the screen in the Situation Room, so I named them if you have any questions, suggestions and ideas.

Sevastopol, please.

Vladimir Shmelkov: Good afternoon, colleagues!

Vladimir Vladimirovich, thank you very much for giving me the floor. Today, in principle, when we were preparing for this forum, we prepared questions. Today, two questions that we were preparing have already been raised.

The first is the question of giving an opportunity to our farmers, including viticulturists. You know that the city of Sevastopol is a hero city, but it is also a resort city, and a city that is very seriously engaged in winemaking.

In our Sevastopol terroir there are about 43 entrepreneurs who are engaged in winemaking issues. And not all of them, of course, but many of them have long dreamed of creating certain places where they could meet their guests, talk about how they went from the beginning of laying grapes to the moment they received the finished product, give people the opportunity to try their product and, let's just say, so that people can stay, as a colleague said, meet the dawn in the morning and enjoy the morning Crimea.

We have heard the answer to this question. Many thanks to Delovaya Rossiya ,the Government, and you, Mr Putin, for raising these issues.

But also what concerns hospitality. In the city of Sevastopol, too, there are a lot of monuments of cultural heritage, I would like them to have an attractive appearance. And the city's businessmen would like to invest in these buildings and structures. We have also already heard the answer to this question, and I would like to thank you again for the opportunity to say that these questions also concern our hero city.

Vladimir Putin: Thank you very much.

Donetsk, please.

Vladimir Fomenko: Good afternoon, Mr President.

The development of Novorossiya and increasing economic connectivity with other regions of the Russian Federation is impossible without a comprehensive development of transport and logistics infrastructure. After the collapse of the Soviet Union, the former authorities almost did not invest in it. Novorossiya needs to be restored, providing logistics of necessary materials, industrial and agricultural products, and consumer goods by rail. To do this, we need to build modern transport and logistics centers.

There are two problems here. First, the legal status of land plots in Novorossiya is often not regulated. It is not clear who owned the land before 2014, because there is no access to the Ukrainian state register of real estate in the DPR. It is necessary to minimize the risk of legal uncertainty and protect the interests of investors in the situation of possible claims from persons with Ukrainian property documents.

Secondly, changes in the type of permitted use of a land plot require extensive work to bring it in line with the purpose of building a shopping mall. And for the construction of priority objects, we need an accelerated procedure for assigning VRI to the corresponding land plots. Please consider this possibility. This will greatly accelerate the recovery and development of the entire Novorossiya region.

Thank you very much.

Vladimir Putin: Yes, thanks. Marat Shakirzyanovich and I have discussed this issue many times, and it is true that these issues are so subtle, but they need to be addressed, I agree. Because it hinders development.

Marat Shakirzyanovich, can you add something here?

Mikhail Khusnullin: Yes, Mr Putin, we are indeed going through a full inventory of land plots. We will do most of our work in this area by the end of the year.

We have now worked out an additional mechanism for expedited registration of real estate and land plots. We hear this question on a weekly basis at the working group. Therefore, if a colleague really wants to build, we invite them, and we will accompany them manually. Moreover, we have adopted a decision and a law on a free economic zone, which provides additional benefits. Today, more than 300 participants have already registered in this free economic zone.

Taking this opportunity, Mr President, given that the entire business community is here, I invite all my colleagues to invest in Novorossiya. There are excellent opportunities for growth, there is nothing to be afraid of there. If two or three years ago we didn't have enough applicants there, now there are more and more applicants. Mr Putin, we will regulate all land and legal relations by the end of the year with regulatory acts.

Thank you.

Vladimir Putin: Good.

Marat Shakirzyanovich said that he invites everyone to invest. Yes, indeed, there is something to invest in, and the land there is very fertile in terms of agriculture, and fertile in terms of tourism development–-the Azov Sea region and so on. There are a lot of very interesting components, including the preferential mortgage rate remains and so on. There is a lot to work on here, and the conditions are really attractive.

Marat Shakirzyanovich, please help the colleague who asked the question. You suggested it yourself in manual mode, but I would like to work out general criteria related to the use of land and the status of this land without manual mode. I understand that this is not easy to do, I understand. But still, you and I have indeed approached this projectile many times, and you have repeatedly reported to me.

Now I will not go into the nuances associated with documents that are not available, or something else. But we need to work out a common order, a common one, and we need to de-bureaucratize it as much as possible, regardless of what happened before. We must proceed from what we have now and what the country and these regions we are talking about are interested in.

Then I will ask Maxim Stanislavovich to also make sure to note this in the assignment, so that nothing is forgotten, does not hang up. There is a lot of turnover, but we must not only work on this, but also make a final decision.

So, we need to slowly complete our event. I hope that it was interesting for everyone who took part in it. First of all, I mean, of course, representatives of business. Our colleagues from the Government have expressed their views on the issues that you have raised. And that's what's bothering you. And I very much hope that our event today will benefit business development, and our future joint work will have a significant impact on maintaining economic growth and its quality.

We are talking about a soft landing in order to ensure development, as I said at the beginning of our event, within the framework of observing macroeconomic indicators, because they are the basis for development. It is also very difficult for us... you to work very hard without bringing inflationary processes to the proper state, to the target indicators, because this does not allow us to plan long-term investments and complicates the work in the most significant way.

We did a lot of things together, otherwise there would not have been 4.1 percent growth in the year before last and 4.3 percent in [last] year. We all basically understand everything, so to speak, we know where this growth is coming from. And this is not only the military-industrial complex. Everyone's talking: MIC, MIC. Yes, the military-industrial complex has made a significant contribution to the development of economic growth rates, but not only the military-industrial complex, not only the defense industry, but everything that we have just discussed here. This is not the defense industry. Winemaking–-what does the military-industrial complex have to do with it? Your destination is hospitality, high technology, and so on. This is all a huge contribution to the development of the economy.

And we must make extremely pragmatic decisions. I have already said it, and I will repeat it again: we have shown good growth rates in previous years. And what happened to those who tried to interfere with us and harmed themselves in an effort to prevent us? We have a very good saying among the people: "Do not dig another hole, you will fall into it yourself." The United States, in spite of everything, acts very pragmatically, they do not forget themselves. We still supply nuclear fuel to the United States–-and nothing. Here you are laughing, but it's true. Why? But because it is profitable. And that's right, and well done. And their economic growth is so significant, quite decent for them. Not 4.3, but still very decent. And Europe's major economies actually fell into recession.

Here is the result. And we must also act very pragmatically at every step. And we need to do it together. Business, here the administration, labor collectives, as I said. Listen to them, please listen to people, it is always useful.

And, of course, the Government, the Central Bank. In general, our work is structured in this way. At the end of last year, we held a regular meeting with the business community. Right there, my colleagues were telling me what they were asking me to pay attention to. And the government as a whole is following this path. Therefore, we need feedback. In this case, today's event is the feedback that we are trying to achieve in order to get a common result for the benefit of Russia.

Thank you very much. Success. Thank you, thank you very much. Good luck. [My Emphasis]

Those who made it to the end learned quite a lot about Russia and its business ethics along with its ongoing war with inflation while doing its utmost to better Russian lives through development. Finding out how the problem of the Black/Gray Economy was solved was also worth it for those of us trying to learn more about Russia’s social development: Bringing that large class of people into Russian social normality was very important. Yet, we read that Russian law still needs to further evolve as societal and business problems continue to be revealed. Alexey Repik’s not so subtle announcement that inflation “almost stopped last week” was a surprise and lends credence to the worry that the economy will freeze, although Putin’s confident the landing will be soft. I expect a report on the Sowing Season soon so I can expand on it by writing about Russia’s Ag sector. For American readers: Can you imagine the head of Kroger meeting with Trump to ask for legislation beneficial for the educating for the workforce and hiring of disabled people? Russia’s disabled population is about 7% based on the number provided, with four million that could be added to the workforce. One of the best ways to judge a nation and its people is to look at how they treat the aged and disabled. IMO, it’s hard to beat Russia for its morality on those issues. I recall the utter heartlessness (genocidal IMO) treatment of Russian pensioners during the 1990s Rape of Russia—millions died hungry and cold. At the end, IMO Yeltsin was haunted by those ghosts. The 1990s memory IMO provides much motivation for Russians—Never Again!

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