Putin Meets Orban: European Mutiny Continues

They smiled for the cameras. The posture in other photos is different. Below, waiting for the cameras to go away:

Both sides brought witnesses.

And before the statements to the press and one crucial Q&A.

After meeting with Zelensky, Hungarian Prime Minister Vicor Orban met with President Putin which I see as a sign that the European Mutiny as Crooks has called it is well underway with Hungary’s ascension to the President of the Council of the European Union. There’s not much said at first for the cameras as the initial speeches satisfied protocol and no more:

Vladimir Putin: Dear Mr. Prime Minister, Dear colleagues!

Welcome to Moscow, Russia.

I understand that this time you have arrived not only as our long-standing partner, but also as the President of the EU Council. I hope we will have an opportunity to exchange views on building bilateral relations in this difficult situation and, of course, to talk about the prospects for the development of the biggest European crisis, I mean in the Ukrainian direction.

I know that quite recently, in my opinion, on July 2, you were in Kiev and now you have arrived here to discuss all the nuances of the situation that has developed in the Kiev direction, in the Ukrainian direction. I am at your disposal.

You probably know about my speech to the leadership of the Foreign Ministry recently in Moscow. It sets out our positions on a possible peaceful settlement. And of course, I am ready to discuss this with you, tell you about some nuances. I hope that you will also acquaint me with your position and that of our European partners.

As for bilateral relations, unfortunately, we are experiencing a big decline in trade turnover, more than 35 percent. But in general, there is something to work on. We are implementing solid projects.

In any case, we are very happy to see you and have a lot to talk about.

Welcome, Mr. Prime Minister.

: Orban Viktor Orban Prime Minister of Hungary Dear Mr. President,

Thank you for seeing me today. This is not our first meeting in the last decade, but our eleventh. But this one is more special than the previous ones.

As you have already mentioned, Hungary has assumed the rotating presidency of the Council of the European Union since July 1. Before our last meeting, it was before the war, it was in February 2022. This is exactly what distinguishes these two meetings.

I am very grateful that even in such difficult conditions you agreed to see me. I must tell you that the number of countries that can talk to both sides of the conflict is rapidly decreasing. Soon Hungary will probably be the only country in Europe that can talk to everyone. I would like to use this opportunity to discuss a number of important issues with you. I would also like to know your position on a number of important issues for Europe.

Thank you.

The statements to the media afterward were also rather formal. The 17-minute video shows us each man’s demeanor. The one question and its responses at the end are classic.

Vladimir Putin: Dear Mr. Prime Minister, Ladies and gentlemen,

I have just completed a very intensive meeting with Hungarian Prime Minister Viktor Orban.

It is important that even in the current difficult geopolitical situation, we continue our dialogue.

As in the course of many previous meetings, we had a really useful and frank conversation both on topical aspects of bilateral cooperation and, of course, on acute issues on the international and regional agenda, including the situation around Ukraine.

I would like to note that Russia and Hungary continue to cooperate in a number of areas, primarily in the energy sector. And the key principles are healthy pragmatism and mutual benefit.

Work continues on the flagship joint expansion project of the Paks nuclear power plant. The commissioning of the fifth and sixth units will increase the capacity of this station by more than half. This will improve the energy supply of the Hungarian economy, as well as the supply of low-cost and clean energy to industrial enterprises and households. When constructing new blocks, only the most advanced engineering and technological solutions are used, and physical safety and environmental requirements are fully ensured.

We continue to support cooperation in medicine and the pharmaceutical industry. We are in favor of continuing to work in priority areas of cooperation.

Of course, there was a fairly thorough, direct and honest exchange of views on topical international issues, including the Ukrainian conflict. They also talked about possible ways to resolve it.

Mr. Prime Minister spoke about his recent meetings in Kiev, where he made a number of proposals and, in particular, called for a cease-fire to create conditions for starting negotiations with Russia.

As for Russia, I have repeatedly said that we have always been and remain open to discussing a political and diplomatic settlement. However, on the other hand, we hear about the unwillingness to solve the issue in this way. And the sponsors of Ukraine continue to try to use this country and its people as a battering ram, a victim in the confrontation with Russia.

As we see the state of affairs, including taking into account what Mr. Prime Minister said today, Kiev is still not ready to abandon the idea of waging a "war to the bitter end".

In my opinion, the Kiev regime does not allow the very idea of ending hostilities also because in this case the pretext for extending martial law disappears. And if they have to lift martial law, then they will have to hold elections that never took place on time. But the chances of winning them for the Ukrainian rulers who have lost their rating and legitimacy are close to zero.

And our peace initiative was outlined quite recently at my meeting with the leadership of the Ministry of Foreign Affairs of the Russian Federation. Its implementation, it seems to us, would make it possible to stop fighting and start negotiations. And it should not be just a truce or a temporary suspension of fire, not some kind of pause that the Kiev regime could use to restore losses, regroup and rearm. Russia stands for a complete and final end to the conflict. The conditions for this, as I have already said, are set out in my speech at the Ministry of Foreign Affairs. We are talking about the complete withdrawal of all Ukrainian troops from the Donetsk and Luhansk People's Republics, from Zaporozhye and Kherson regions. There are other conditions. But this is a subject for fairly detailed consideration in the course of possible joint work.

Dear Ladies and gentlemen,

Taking into account the fact that Hungary has been holding the presidency of the Council of the European Union since July 1, Mr. Orban and I exchanged views on the state of affairs in relations between Russia and the European Union, which are currently at their lowest point. We also discussed possible principles of a future, also possible, security architecture in Europe.

In general, the talks were very timely and, I think, useful for both sides. Of course, Mr. Prime Minister expressed the Western point of view, which is generally known to us, including from the point of view of Ukraine's interests. Nevertheless, we are grateful to Mr. Prime Minister for visiting Moscow. We see this as an attempt to restore the dialogue and give it an additional impetus.

Thank you.

:(as translated)Vladimir Orban Ladies and gentlemen,

Dear Mr. President,

Today I met with the President of Russia for the 11th time. The peculiarity of this meeting is that it is held during a time of war, at a time when Europe really needs peace. Peace is the most important thing for Europe. We consider the struggle for peace to be the main task for the next six months of our European presidency.

I told Mr. President that the greatest development in Europe took place during the peaceful decades. Now we in Europe have been living in the shadow of war for two and a half years. This causes huge difficulties in Europe. We cannot feel safe, we see pictures of destruction and suffering. This war has already begun to affect economic growth and our competitiveness.

In general, as I said to Mr. President, Europe needs peace. Over the past two and a half years, we have realized that without diplomacy, without communication channels, we will not achieve peace. Peace will not come by itself, you need to work for it.

I discussed the ways of achieving peace with Mr. President today. I wanted to know what was the shortest way to end the war. I wanted to hear and heard Mr. President's opinion on three important issues: what he thinks about the current peace initiatives, what he also thinks about the cease-fire and peace talks, in what sequence they can be held, and the third thing I was interested in was the vision of Europe after the war. I am grateful to Mr. President for an open and honest conversation.

Ladies and gentlemen,

Over the past 2.5 years, there have been almost no countries that could have contact with both sides of the conflict. Hungary is one of the very few such countries. That's why I was in Kiev last week, and that's why I'm in Moscow now.

I've learned from experience that the positions are very far apart. There are a lot of steps that need to be taken to get closer to the end of the war. However, the most important step we took was to establish contact. And I will continue to work in this direction.

Thank you.

Question: How did Mr. Zelensky react to your proposal for a cease-fire? What did he say to that?

Viktor Orban: I told this to the President of the Russian Federation.

Question: Mr President, could you tell us something?

Vladimir Putin: No. [My Emphasis]

Orban: “Peace is the most important thing for Europe.” That fact can’t be made any plainer, and its extension: Freedom from the Outlaw US Empire that causes it all. And Putin couldn’t make it any plainer either: “Russia stands for a complete and final end to the conflict.” The other discussion that surely occurred was that of the new Anti-Brussels political alignment being formed that includes Hungary. Orban’s seemingly cryptic description of the Ukraine situation was grounded in realism, not NATO fantasy. Now that the positions are even more detailed, we shall see how further the political tide shifts in Europe—”Europe needs peace.”

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